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Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by chongli on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @02:30PM (#33181049)
Completely missed the boat on mobile

I think their main error was short-termism. They were addicted to high margin (workstation/server) devices. They had no interest in the low margins of mobile devices. They could not imagine how low-power devices would take over the world.

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by magicloop on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @02:51PM (#33181329)
Actually that is the "Innovator's Dilemma" in action. Managers will always prefer to safeguard and enhance the high margin aspects of the business and discourage/under-invest in low margin disruptor aspects of the business due to cannibalization of profits and thus missing profit guidance for the quarter (thus losing compensation personally). They knew the tide was changing but organisation dynamics prevents a course correction.

Only a few companies can buck the Innovator's Dilemma, usually only founder led enterprises with significant control.

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by wahern on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @03:11PM (#33181614)
> missing profit guidance for the quarter

The Innovator's Dilemma isn't about missing quarterly guidance. The dilemma is that it's perfectly rational and profit maximizing to continue focusing on your cash cow even when obsolescence is a foregone conclusion. It wouldn't be a true dilemma, otherwise.

The incumbent is the only player that can maximally squeeze the very considerable remaining profits from old technology, and they should do so with gusto. Moreover, switching to new technologies comes with more risk, even when it seems obvious what the new market will look like because the old market has almost zero risk--it's completely proven.

All the "solutions" to avoid the dilemma, like selling the old technology to take future profits and then pivoting to the new market, are just corporate branding shell games. They might even be in fact sub-optimal, but in any event the fundamental dynamics remain the same.

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by noobermin on Thursday October 13, 2022 @12:10AM (#33187132)
Except it didn't actually work out. It worked out at the time, and thus was "perfectly rational" then but rationality should not have a limited time horizon because then it is limited. This is the problem with short-term thinking, it eventually leads to loss.
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by wahern on Thursday October 13, 2022 @04:05PM (#33195858)
What value is there in corporations being immortal? That is, why forego substantial and easy profits merely to exist as the same corporation further down the road?

There are transaction costs to creating and building a corporation, but do those offset the clear costs of leaving money on the table, especially in the modern world of highly liquid capital, and particularly in markets with clear technological breaks. The lesson of the Innovator's Dilemma is that very often the perfectly, unqualifiedly rational decision is to press your advantage to the very end. And importantly it not only maximizes short-term profits, but implicitly it maximizes long-term profits globally by most efficiently allocating resources. Why waste energy swimming upstream when there are endless fish spawning and starting their journey upstream already along with ample resources of their own.

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by chongli on Friday October 14, 2022 @12:09PM (#33205406)
There isn't anything particular about a company being immortal. The issue is now. No one wants to be there when a company is dying. There's nothing heroic about "going down with the ship" in the corporate world.
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by piggybox on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @02:53PM (#33181357)
It's reported Steve Jobs did ask Intel to provide CPU for the first gen of iPhone, but the offer price was too low so Intel would lose money. If you were the CEO of Intel, how would you explain it to the board that "we should make this deal with Apple even with loss, because I think iPhone will be the next big thing"?
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by magicloop on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @03:24PM (#33181774)
The proposal was unstable on both sides in fact. Jobs didn't fully appreciate the importance of power efficiency at the time - an internal team scrambled to demonstrate why Intel would have been a non-starter due to power budget. There were also ecosystem issues, since gearing up for an embedded device at that time mostly meant choosing ARM architecture for that complexity tier they were engineering.

So a deal based on any price wasn't a realistic avenue for iPhone. The fact that Intel was actually considered was itself a radical move on behalf of Steve (absent the technical obstacles that emerged later).

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by AnimalMuppet on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @03:07PM (#33181560)
Did Intel counter-offer? I mean, if someone offers you a bad deal, your options are not restricted to "yes" and "no".
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by kccqzy on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @08:26PM (#33185636)
Likely they did but Apple didn't want to pay more. Apple generally is not known to be flexible when it comes to business deals with suppliers.

This is reported in a profile of Otellini:

> "We ended up not winning it or passing on it, depending on how you want to view it. And the world would have been a lot different if we'd done it," Otellini told me in a two-hour conversation during his last month at Intel. "The thing you have to remember is that this was before the iPhone was introduced and no one knew what the iPhone would do... At the end of the day, there was a chip that they were interested in that they wanted to pay a certain price for and not a nickel more and that price was below our forecasted cost. I couldn't see it. It wasn't one of these things you can make up on volume. And in hindsight, the forecasted cost was wrong and the volume was 100x what anyone thought."

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2013/05/paul-...

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by AnimalMuppet on Thursday October 13, 2022 @12:55AM (#33187394)
If they blew their cost estimate that badly, then yes, it is a massive error on Intel's part.
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by wvenable on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @02:55PM (#33181380)
Which is ironic because it was their low margin desktop products that eventually took over the high margin workstation/server market in the 90's.
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by zubiaur on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @02:59PM (#33181444)
They missed the boat twice. Once with their sale of their ARM XScale branch, in 2006 for 600MM (such bad timing). Later with their blunders with Atom on mobile.
Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by nightski on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @03:38PM (#33181969)
Apple gets incredibly high margins on their products probably leaving more play room.

Is there any evidence that mobile chip makers who do not also create/own the device and are in a race to the bottom on price actually get decent returns?

Re:Intel will lay off 20'000 employees by acchow on Wednesday October 12, 2022 @06:04PM (#33184194)
Intel also doubled down on x86. Apple, in contrast, is creating the ARM future by designing their own chips, x86-to-Arm emulation layer, and compiler toolchains