Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need updates

Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by layer8 on Monday September 26, 2022 @06:17PM (#32989328)

There are ways to still maintain API compatibility in that case (Windows does it all the time), and it’s also not a reason to require projects not affected by those changes to recompile with the newest Xcode version each year. I’m maintaining a Swift library/framework that doesn’t use any iOS APIs at all, only basic Swift standard library calls, and I still have to produce a new build each year from unchanged source code so that the library can be consumed with the new Xcode version. That’s just insane.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Monday September 26, 2022 @06:20PM (#32989362)

Why is it insane? Do you not test your library with new versions of the OS?

Also - “windows does it” is obviously irrelevant when we are talking about a mobile OS.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by layer8 on Monday September 26, 2022 @06:28PM (#32989420)

Testing with a new OS version shouldn’t (and usually doesn’t) require rebuilding the project. The need to rebuild is imposed primarily by the Xcode releases here, not by the OS. And that seems entirely unnecessary. Note that breaking compatibility and having to rebuild for new Xcode versions are two independent and orthogonal issues here.

I won't continue this discussion about maintaining compatibility. This is fundamentally a philosophical issue. I agree with the sibling comment that it is the job of an OS to provide stable APIs across versions. It requires some effort (as a long-term library maintainer, I'm very well aware of this), but it is not an impossibility at all.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Monday September 26, 2022 @07:48PM (#32990115)

The sibling and you are entitled to this preference, but I don’t see anything philosophical about it.

The job of the computer is to serve the end user. The job of the OS is to manage the computer’s resources on the users behalf.

API stability can contribute to that goal, but this is not an absolute.

Apple balances their view of what is good for users over what is good for developers and themselves.

Your preference is to prioritize developer comfort over both end users and Apple.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by kcb on Monday September 26, 2022 @09:10PM (#32990613)

Being able to continue using an older not actively maintained app they still want to use is pretty good for the end user...

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Monday September 26, 2022 @09:30PM (#32990720)

Maybe a tiny minority of end users, where the breaking changes benefit everyone else.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by int_19h on Monday September 26, 2022 @10:55PM (#32991114)

New features in the API indirectly benefit the end users (once apps start using them). But those new features don't have to be breaking, and that part doesn't help the users at all. It does help Apple spend less resources on maintenance, though.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Monday September 26, 2022 @11:18PM (#32991225)

Changes to old features also benefit the end users, and they do have to be breaking in a significant number of cases.

If you think there are no insecure or inefficient APIs in older versions of operating systems, then you are simply wrong.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by RedShift1 on Monday September 26, 2022 @06:32PM (#32989468)

The whole point of an OS is to provide a stable API to use.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Monday September 26, 2022 @07:45PM (#32990094)

This has never been true. The point of an OS is to manage the resources of the computer on behalf of the user.

API stability sometimes serves the end user, and sometimes does not. When it does not, it should not be maintained.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by kcb on Monday September 26, 2022 @09:12PM (#32990623)

Being able to use the app you want to use serves the end user pretty well.

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Re:Outdated vs. Complete: In defense of apps that don’t need... by newtritious on Tuesday September 27, 2022 @11:23AM (#32996544)

Yes, that’s the point here. A few end users can use an app the developer has abandoned, at the expense of the millions.

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