News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by hedora on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:03PM (#32786990)
I'd rather they spend the money on a ballot initiative that says they have a certain amount of time to reject a permit, and it simply issues (with a refund of the permit processing fees) if the deadline passes.

To close the resulting loophole where they just reject all permits when they have a backlog, there would be automatic penalties for improperly rejected permits, with a floor of an after-tax value of 2 times the financial damage done to applicant; permit office pays legal fees.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by idealmedtech on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:07PM (#32787013)
> it simply issues (with a refund of the permit processing fees) if the deadline passes.

We're a medical device company with Breakthrough Device status, and it works largely like this. Whenever we submit, FDA has 30 days to reach a decision from time of receipt, and if they don't decide, we automatically get approval. Really helps with keeping up momentum!

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by klodolph on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:13PM (#32787055)
California has something called a "builder's remedy". If cities are out of compliance with the HAA, developers can get their building permits approved through an alternative process... it's apparently a bit messy, though, and it only applies when the city is out of compliance in certain ways.

I think it makes a lot more sense then suing the city or issuing fines--at least in theory.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by cortesoft on Saturday September 10, 2022 @12:25AM (#32787790)
I heard builders haven't used this, because they don't want to piss off the city, since they have to work with them again in the future and don't want a bad relationship.
Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by zbrozek on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:50PM (#32787256)
It's going to be really interesting to see how projects attempted under that remedy work out. There's basically no case law on the subject.
Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by 0xy on Saturday September 10, 2022 @01:25AM (#32788049)
Here's how they'll work out; the city will send "random" inspections from the fire department, inspectors and other departments every week to spite you. Applying for any other permit in the city will result in rejection after rejection.

Government is spiteful and vengeful, and wronging them will result in vicious consequence.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by mistermann on Saturday September 10, 2022 @01:59AM (#32788219)
If this keeps up, there may eventually be some vicious, extrajudicial consequences for elected officials.
Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by wahern on Saturday September 10, 2022 @01:27AM (#32788058)
> I'd rather they spend the money on a ballot initiative that says they have a certain amount of time to reject a permit, and it simply issues (with a refund of the permit processing fees) if the deadline passes.

I'm not very familiar with the specifics, but AFAIU the most important municipalities in the state enjoy so-called "Home Rule" under the California Constitution. I believe that means that a self-executing rule such as you've proposed is unconstitutional. Rather, somewhat like the constraints imposed on the Federal government viz-a-viz the states, the state government is often limited to cajoling municipalities through expenditures, budgeting, and law suits.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by dillondoyle on Saturday September 10, 2022 @02:15AM (#32788293)
Cities can have ballot initiatives. Just quick search first link on san fran info below.

There are usually arcane rules. Sometimes things have to get put on by council sometimes cities allow citizen petitions.

Something that changes the charter/constitution versus just an ordinance or a tax/levy.

And sadly activist judges can have too large of a say imho.

https://sfelections.sfgov.org/measures

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by eru on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:08PM (#32787024)
Keep in mind the subtle distinction between spending money on lawsuits, and holding money to threaten suits.

If the latter strategy works out, you don't need to spend the money. So it can be re-used for other threats.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by briandear on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:07PM (#32787012)
Just make it where any permit not rejected within 30 days is automatically approved.
Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by hedora on Friday September 09, 2022 @11:08PM (#32787363)
Our local permit office would just reject things randomly. We had one office cheerfully let us know they didn't plan to spitefully bankrupt us, and half of a two-person department became visibly angry with our general contractor when the other person in that department told us how to tie his hands and force an approval.

These shenanigans cost us rougly $500-1000 a day in insurance, interest, etc. They drug it out for about a year.

The department that decided they liked us has bankrupted multiple people on our street. We'd have at least 5-10% more houses on our street (there is plenty of room) if not for them.

California's state government has an alert on their website specifically listing various things that department did to us and pointing out they were illegal. Instead of suing, we kissed all the right asses in the right order, so now we have a house. Again, this is best case for interacting with them because they liked us, apparently.

Based on conversations with neighbors, my level of satisfaction with this planning office is roughly median for the area, but our experience was way better than average.

Marvin Heemeyer of Killdozer fame is a personal hero of mine now (Don't worrtly, I don't know how to weld. However, I do know how to make campaign donations and vote!):

https://allthatsinteresting.com/marvin-heemeyer-killdozer

Missing from that article are apparently true allegations of direct financial conflicts of interest within the zoning commission, and him being forced to sell land so that one of their cronies could develop it instead. Also note that he fought them for over a decade.

One of our state representatives is running for reelection on a plan to spend huge amounts of state/federal infrastructure money to bypass the office that likes to bankrupt people. 100's of familes will be forced off their land before the plan kicks in (assuming it passes).

So, anyway, there needs to be harsh financial consequences for just rejecting permits for the heck of it.

Ideally, promotions would be tied to correctly processing permit applications. That's probably illegal around here or something.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by imtringued on Saturday September 10, 2022 @06:45AM (#32789438)
Wow, this makes me wonder if our understanding of capitalism is all wrong.

Capitalism is about amassing resources ahead of time and then trying to buy time, create a stalemate and wait it out until the other party has run out of resources and must give up.

Fighting a war accellerates the rate of capital exhaustion and destroys existing capital. Because everyone starts from a blank slate people do not have enough capital to waste on outwaiting their opponent and they instead focus on cooperation resulting in a few wonderful economic decades until everything goes bad again as people use their amassed capital to fight each other.

Re:A legal fund to sue SF over housing deadlock by zbrozek on Friday September 09, 2022 @10:51PM (#32787259)
All permits rejected at 29 days, status quo mostly remains.