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Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by paulryanrogers on Sunday August 14, 2022 @07:53PM (#32464316)
> People governing things together (currently called DAOs). Code you can trust. And so on.

Didn't the first DAO cause a fork of Ethereum? And isn't the most important part of investing understanding what you're investing in?

Apparently these contacts as code are so complex in practice (DSLs require understanding it and all its dependencies.) they tend to be foot guns, waiting for someone more dedicated to find and exploit them.

Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by rglullis on Sunday August 14, 2022 @08:21PM (#32464467)
The DAO didn't "cause a fork". The fork happened because there was a community consensus that the best solution to mitigate the hack was by migrating to a chain where the bug could be fixed. IOW, it was an example that governance is more sociological than technological thing.
Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by Jasper_ on Sunday August 14, 2022 @08:46PM (#32464618)
The community here were namely, the people who were upset their coins were stolen -- the developers, people who had a lot of coins, and miners. All the morals about "code is law", "free from centralized governance" went out the window when gainz were to be had.
Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by rglullis on Sunday August 14, 2022 @09:11PM (#32464767)
The community here is at least 51% of those running nodes on the network. They pretty much were (and still are) "free from centralized governance", so much so that those that disagreed with the change were completely free to keep the other chain.

Anyway, I think that "Code is law" is a bad phrase. A more appropriate (but still silly) phrase would be "Code is law enforcement". The laws themselves still need to be written by people, should still be subject to context-dependent interpretation and should still have room to be changed.

Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by robbiep on Sunday August 14, 2022 @09:56PM (#32465050)
>Anyway, I think that "Code is law" is a bad phrase. A more appropriate (but still silly) phrase would be "Code is law enforcement".

That’s an interesting approach. The popular conception from the evangelists is that code is law, because it’s meant to be a major advantage. By saying it’s not, what real benefits does a DAO/on chain contract offer? Certainly nothing like legal recourse like you’d get in an actual court in the real world.

And ultimately, it appears that code is neither law nor law enforcement. It’s just an opportunity for hackers to occasionally wipe everyone out and a community to scramble to roll things back with significant mud on face

Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by rglullis on Sunday August 14, 2022 @10:42PM (#32465300)
> Certainly nothing like legal recourse like you’d get in an actual court in the real world.

The "real world" is full of corrupt institutions and people in positions of authority that are not working with the interests of ordinary citizens in mind.

The "real world" is also a place where people have ubiquitous access to the internet, but don't have access to banking systems, easy credit or fast/cheap ways to settle minor disputes.

For these situations, a system that can provide an alternative to the established, well-functioning institutions is better than nothing, even if flawed.

Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by robbiep on Monday August 15, 2022 @01:59AM (#32466332)
I know people who have lost money to defi hacks, scams and counterparty risk. The total value significantly exceeds what I believe my friends have ever lost in the real world. So I’m not seeing the corrupt institution risk that is so trumpeted by the cryptobros. I’m also not convinced that ubiquity of internet access is anywhere close to providing a decent alternative in terms of access.
Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by rglullis on Monday August 15, 2022 @04:22AM (#32467106)
Let me guess: your friend is from a reasonably developed country and was putting money on defi as a way to "invest"?
Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by paulryanrogers on Sunday August 14, 2022 @08:43PM (#32464592)
So if the only recourse for bugs in DAOs is for the community to fork the underlying tech then it doesn't sound like a particularly robust system.
Re:Status Traps: Learning from Web2 Social Networks by rglullis on Sunday August 14, 2022 @09:22PM (#32464847)
Your mistake is thinking that the solution that was adopted for one instance of an issue is the only possible solution that can be used forever.

None of this is static. The DAO hack showed a flaw in the then-current practices of smart contracts. Developers learned from it, changes were made to the system. The system became more robust after it.

Much like any organism living in an ambient with evolutionary pressure, different mutations come up. After the DAO hack, some prefer to write their contracts in a way that allow some level of control by trusted admins, some of them still don't like the idea of privileged access to the contracts but will favor adoption of contracts only after formal verification. Some saw that as opportunity to specialize in contract security and become auditors.

None of these approaches are perfect by themselves. Other bugs will come, other "hacks" will exist, and hopefully each of these will act as evolutionary filter on the existing system.

Without a central authority, this is the only I see for systems to evolve. And if the whole point is to create an alternative that does not depend on a central authority, I'm fine with the current approaches to risk management.