Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by ncmncm on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @05:22PM
(#31759624)
Cycle efficiency is trivially resolved by feeding in more zero-opex power.
But hydrogen efficiency is improving as fast as all renewable tech.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by megaman821 on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @06:11PM
(#31760080)
I agree that hydrogen efficiency doesn't matter here, but the capital expenditure to build a giant electrolyzer with 5% utilization doesn't really make sense. The cost of the electrolyzer is the things that needs to greatly fall if hydrogen is going to be used for long-term storage.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by pfdietz on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @07:31PM
(#31760774)
Electrolyzers driven by otherwise curtailed renewables would have a capacity factor much higher than 10%. If I go to https://model.energy/ and solve for the optimal solution for the US for 2011 weather and 2030 cost assumptions, the capacity factor of the electrolyzers is 43%.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by megaman821 on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @07:49PM
(#31760904)
That is more of a what-if. If there was more wind and solar built out there would be enough curtailed energy to run electrolyzers at 43% capacity factor. I am saying today it doesn't make sense because there isn't a lot of over-provisioning taking place. There should be but what investors are going to jump first with a curtailed energy electrolyzer when curtailed energy is low.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by pfdietz on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @08:23PM
(#31761142)
It's a demolition of your nonsensical 5% number (which is also what-if).
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by megaman821 on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @08:46PM
(#31761296)
In the state with the most solar built out in the US the curtailment is 5% https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=49276.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by pfdietz on Wednesday June 15, 2022 @09:38PM
(#31761650)
Which is of course meaningless, since curtailment increases with the amount of installed wind/solar. What matters is how much curtailment there would be in an optimal all-renewable energy system.
I tell you what: show me a cost optimized renewable energy system in which the electrolyzers have a capacity factor of 5%.
Re:Nuclear is back on the table for a green future
by adrianN on Thursday June 16, 2022 @03:32AM
(#31763410)
Hydrogen has important industrial uses. Currently we get it from natural gas. That has to change in the future.
For hydrogen, we have to solve the horrible cycle efficiency of its storage. It's not so bad for use as a fuel (e.g. for airplanes), but as static storage hydrogen is currently a very bad choice.