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Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by miika on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:07PM (#31250717)
There is also another model about memory which I totally love. In that memory is not stored but brain is more like an antenna which can retrieve information from the space time coordinates where events actually took place.

Because everything is constantly moving around something each event in the universe probably has unique location, a real physical place where it happened.

So, the idea is that as we’re moving through space we’re leaving a trail as the events are (lack of better word) “printed” in the fabric of space. Then as apparently Space is not empty at all but filled with Planck scale micro wormholes entangling all things into this one universal neural network, then our brains should be very well capable of tracing back our unique trails through space and retrieve information through those micro wormholes.

As developer I think it would make most sense to only save references rather than trying store all events inside everyones brains. That would be huge waste of resources and just damn stupid.

And probably the way we humans have built our computers also reflects how the universe really works, because after all we are bits of the universe doing whatever the universe is doing.

Peace

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by IIAOPSW on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @07:56PM (#31255184)
This is quantum woo fueled neo cartesian dualist bullocks. Sorry not sorry. For starters, if events in space and any point in time are accessible as "memories", the laws of physics that enable that shouldn't constrain the only application to memory. The same physical mechanism would have to enable telepathy and even time travel. Secondly, it violates the whole "no hidden variables" results from recent Bell inequality QM experiments. Third of all, it requires long term stable room temperature entanglement basically everywhere (HAHAHA LOL NO). Fourth, it flies in the face of what we do know about how neurons compute things vis a vis signal spikes and activation potentials. Fifth, it fails to account for the numerous, reproducible experiments demonstrating the creation of erroneous memories made from whole cloth. Need I go on?

I can't believe this comment isn't buried. Its one thing to engage in a bit of rank speculation outside your specialty, but this is straight-up crackpot science.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by eyelidlessness on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @09:20PM (#31255721)
This would be a much more valuable and informative comment if it wasn’t so wrapped in self-aware rude delivery. Saying so as someone who is prone to make that mistake.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by IIAOPSW on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @10:32PM (#31256101)
Its one thing to make an honest mistake, its another thing to make half-baked conjectures about entire swaths of research fields where people have made careers and wrote full-baked PhD thesis's. Its frankly disrespectful to everyone's time when someone who hasn't even tried to be reasonably informed makes up some random explanation for everything and presents it as if their "insight" is worth anything whatsoever. My rudeness is on par and in response to rudeness. Failing to make bullshit feel unwelcome in the most uncertain terms is nothing more than an invitation for more bullshit.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by eyelidlessness on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @11:01PM (#31256270)
My entire point was that you’ll make more bullshit unwelcome, if you know better, by kindly inviting more well meaning bullshitters to reconsider their bullshit than by clobbering them. It’s not quite win flies with honey but it’s a narrower application of the same principle.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by wrycoder on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @11:19PM (#31256378)
I see no need to tolerate literally ignorant rambling at the expense of informed commentary.

If a site keeps doing that, competent people go elsewhere. Why is that post the top comment on an interesting paper from MIT?

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by eyelidlessness on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @12:46AM (#31256866)
I see no need to tolerate ignorant non sequiturs but I’ll be kind in the spirit of my point and ask that you re-read my prior comments and hopefully understand that’s not what I’m suggesting.

Being inflexibly and uniformly critical of all ignorance also drives people off. And the direct subject to a reply isn’t always the most important audience. Sometimes you’re persuading people who are passively reading along. If that sounds absurd in this scenario, consider the number of times a gentler rebuttal in a discussion has given you pause to reconsider some foolish idea you hadn’t expressed. If you can’t think of one, you’re either an outlier genius or maybe overconfident and overcompensating.

Either way, most people aren’t dissuaded of their ignorance by being chastised for it. Speaking as someone who’s lost important friends learning that the hard way.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by wrycoder on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @12:12PM (#31262445)
You must be young.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by eyelidlessness on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @08:20PM (#31267728)
Okay I’m genuinely curious. Younger than…?
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by taosx on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @10:31PM (#31256099)
The value and information of @IIAOPSW comment is just gold when you compare it to the primary one. The delivery brings additional value corresponding to the absurdity of the post.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by mxmilkiib on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @07:57AM (#31259264)
Some times expressing left-field/weird artistic/speculative/magical thoughts acts like having a tattoo on your face, i.e., it makes condescending anti-social people more likely out theirselves, which can be both informative and entertaining.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by wrycoder on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @11:08PM (#31256313)
It’s hard to believe that fluff is the top rated comment.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by SketchySeaBeast on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @10:14AM (#31260735)
Wait, it wasn't a tongue in cheek joke? Are people taking it seriously??? I thought HackerNews was enjoying a rare sense of humor.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by lm28469 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:34PM (#31251067)
> As developer I think it would make most sense to only save references rather than trying store all events inside everyones brains. That would be huge waste of resources and just damn stupid.

> And probably the way we humans have built our computers also reflects how the universe really works, because after all we are bits of the universe doing whatever the universe is doing.

I think this is way too simplistic. Just like planes don't fly like birds, computers don't work like "the universe"

We don't know much about the brain at all and starting to think about it in terms of "computer" logic seems very wrong to me. Computers are our very crude and poor attempt at replicating brains/intelligence, by definition they're built on ultra simplified principles that our own brains came up with, using computer terms to define the brain/universe is closing a loop that doesn't exist

It only sounds like a waste because you(we)'re constrained by our own brains, the universe doesn't care about our ability to understand or make sense of it. Something might sound unoptimised to you(us) but might be the only way allowed by physics.

Naming and defining computer parts using human/brain related terms was an error imho, it confuses people and make them think we are able to replicate (or even understand) things that we have no clue about, they're very poor analogies.

> That would be huge waste of resources and just damn stupid.

Isn't the entire universe a huge waste of resource and just damn stupid ?

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by e_i_pi_2 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @05:44PM (#31253992)
Yeah I always like to think like this sometimes, but as far as we know a "reference" doesn't make sense in the brain - it doesn't have access to external stuff so in the brain context it would be like neurons connecting to a single neuron. Aside from something like a URL a computer can't reference anything outside of itself and I don't think we have a brain equivalent
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by pyinstallwoes on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @04:43AM (#31258118)
Planes fly more like fish swim in the sea.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by elliekelly on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:49PM (#31251993)
Helicopters kind of fly like birds don’t they?
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by hirako2000 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @04:20PM (#31253075)
Rather like some particular family of insects. Both planes (depending on their engine part) and helicopters use aero propulsion but their mechanisms differ somewhat as much as for between helicopters and birds.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by outworlder on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:20PM (#31252343)
They don't. They fly because they are so ugly that the ground repels them.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by astrange on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @09:28PM (#31255771)
They're more like maple seeds.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by glenstein on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:51PM (#31251263)
> “printed” in the fabric of space. Then as apparently Space is not empty at all but filled with Planck scale micro wormholes entangling all things into this one universal neural network, then our brains should be very well capable of tracing back our unique trails through space and retrieve information through those micro wormholes.

That's fun enough if that's intended as some form of recreational speculative fiction/sci-fi. I'm all about that.

But you said "model", without qualification, so its hard for me to tell from your comment the extent to which you want to put this forward as something that stands a chance of really being true.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by flatline on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:39PM (#31251863)
In Buddhist philosophy the mind is a sixth sense organ, perceiving thoughts. The Lankavatara Sutra from Mahayana buddhism goes into some detail as to how karma is formed, past life memories and the like, in the “storehouse consciousness” which is basically encoded into the world around us by our actions. I thought your post was very beautiful and similar in spirit to a lot of ancient philosophy on consciousness.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by outworlder on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:19PM (#31252336)
That's potentially a good starting point for a sci-fi setting.

That's unlikely to have any resemblance to how brains work though. For one, we would be lacking the mechanism to do such a 'retrieval'. We can also influence memory formation.

Say you binge drink. You are temporarily unable to form memories. We can pinpoint the exact area affected. Unless alcohol is somehow able to influence the micro-wormholes, it shouldn't affect memories at all.

> As developer I think it would make most sense to only save references rather than trying store all events inside everyones brains.

Remember, nature does not care about that.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by jameshart on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:05PM (#31252191)
Seems like there's nothing in that model that would stop you from being able to remember events that didn't even happen to you.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by shiftpgdn on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:09PM (#31252234)
Encryption with a signed keypair maybe.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by pyinstallwoes on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @04:44AM (#31258125)
The soul is my private key?! Haha.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by SketchySeaBeast on Wednesday May 04, 2022 @10:16AM (#31260753)
So that's why the devil wants them!
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by zdragnar on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @04:56PM (#31253467)
Or events that didn't happen, or memories formed differently from how events actually occurred...
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by phantompeace on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:21PM (#31250896)
Created an account to say that this post has probably changed my life. What an extremely interesting thought.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by exitheone on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:56PM (#31252088)
Keep in mind that this comment is in no way even a tiny bit compatible with our current understanding of how the brain works. Treat it as a good sci-fi plot.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by daniel-cussen on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @06:31PM (#31254429)
Yeah well that's what I did, but by sci-fi plot standards it had a huge amount of merit and originality.

This isn't a peer-reviewed journal, nor the Bible. And your comment contributes too, by pointing out it isn't consistent with Western medicine. You're helping the reader who happened to buy into that, not to try combining it with scientific mainstream things, not talk about it at the water cooler, and not talk about it for instance when being psychologically evaluated. Like even if the psych likes you if you say things like that it's out of his hands and he has to flunk you. That's the mistake Feynman made, he talks about flunking a psych exam for the military, but like full-on full F, like they used special words to describe how poor they judged his mind to be, and then he replied to them accepting the F and asking to be flunked harder on the basis it was clearly crazy to write them that letter.

And he was constantly thinking about the fabric of the universe, entertained many wild theories to arrive at sound ones, I'm sure of that.

But yeah, thanks for saying that, in case readers didn't take that comment with a grain of salt. Yours was the grain of salt.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by Eldt on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @08:30PM (#31255428)
I don't think science, and the application of the scientific method, can be fairly categorised as "western medicine". We all have shower thoughts but I keep mine to myself, at least until I can actually demonstrate something with it.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by jerry1979 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @10:20PM (#31256042)
Do you at least write them down for yourself?
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by daniel-cussen on Thursday May 05, 2022 @06:42PM (#31279198)
Yeah Feynman wrote them down sometimes, way before being able to demonstrate. Von Neumann too. Einstein. Wrote down theories before they were laws.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by lobstrosity420 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:42PM (#31251155)
This is a very interesting idea. My criticism would be that our memories are such imperfect recollections of the real thing that its hard for me not to see them as a "copy" rather than a "pointer". Signal loss through the fabric of space?
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by SketchySeaBeast on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:00PM (#31252125)
Clearly the brain is the message processing center for the antenna, which is the pineal gland.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by jasfi on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @11:55PM (#31256560)
Do you have any scientific references to back this up? I agree that there could be something to your theory.

References make sense to me as well, but I also agree with the conclusion of this article, that memories are distributed. If you put the two together, then I think it works well. Those could be distributed references, that when fired together, activate a specific memory somewhere else in space-time.

Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by omegadeep10 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:14PM (#31250794)
This reminds me of the book Recursion by Blake Crouch. In the book, scientists figure out how to use memories to time travel. Interesting concept.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by treeman79 on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:52PM (#31251288)
True or not. This would make much better sci-fi trope then current quantum entanglement plot lines
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by pvarangot on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @03:55PM (#31252779)
Coherence (2013) was pretty good though. Haven't really seen a quantum entanglement movie after that one.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by namlem on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:56PM (#31251334)
Reminds me somewhat of the Pale in Disco Elysium
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by pcardoso on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:06PM (#31251449)
This reminds me of the the Stephen's Baxter book "the light of other days". A wormhole device was used to capture video from any spacetime coordinates. It was a nice book.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by Salgat on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @11:30PM (#31256432)
I'll have whatever this guy is having.
Re:A single memory is stored across many connected brain reg... by myth_drannon on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @05:47PM (#31254026)
That's too much of Dan Simmons here.