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Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by bryanrasmussen on Friday April 29, 2022 @02:39PM (#31209076)
It would be against GDPR because you cannot sign away your privacy rights to get a service to work if that service does not need your private data to function - the camera does not need your data to function therefore contract not legal in Europe
Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by kube-system on Friday April 29, 2022 @03:10PM (#31209442)
Unless the telemetry they are talking about is anonymized.
Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by Nextgrid on Friday April 29, 2022 @03:14PM (#31209485)
Which it absolutely isn't, since they're reserving themselves the right to use it for advertising purposes. If it was properly anonymised it would be completely useless for such purposes.
Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by kube-system on Friday April 29, 2022 @03:24PM (#31209607)
That is likely a fair assumption, but an assumption nonetheless. There exists marketing data which does not identify individuals.
Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by red_throwaway on Friday April 29, 2022 @04:01PM (#31209976)
> There exists marketing data which does not identify individuals.

As these datasets grow (and they only grow), it becomes trivial to tie anonymized profiles to a specific person. They leave off names and it's expected that the final consumer of the data do the "last mile" work of tying it to the name. The easy part.

Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by bryanrasmussen on Friday April 29, 2022 @04:02PM (#31209989)
it's actually pretty difficult to anonymize data and not have it be able to de-anonymized, at any rate the question regarded privacy rights and if things are anonymized that's not what the question would be then.
Re:Ask HN: Is the EULA on my new $30k RED cinema camera legal? by Jon_Lowtek on Friday April 29, 2022 @04:42PM (#31210353)
i agree, this goes against GDPR.7.4 https://gdpr.eu/article-7-how-to-get-consent-to-collect-pers... see especially the recital https://gdpr.eu/Recital-43-Freely-given-consent/

>> Consent is presumed not to be freely given ... if the performance of a contract, including the provision of a service, is dependent on the consent despite such consent not being necessary for such performance.

Also note GDPR.7.3

>> The data subject shall have the right to withdraw his or her consent at any time. [...] It shall be as easy to withdraw as to give consent.

If you can't withdraw the consent, it is not consent. So this EULA is at least bad form. (from a european perspective)

For the far more interesting question if it is legal see https://gdpr.eu/article-6-how-to-process-personal-data-legal...

If it is not consent then it falls under GDPR.6.1.f "legitimate interests" which is far worse to discuss, as it puts your fundamental right to not have the usage of a product you bought be surveilled by the manufacturer - against their business interest to get telemetry. It would be far easier for everyone if they would just make it a separate checkbox you can toggle on and off (actual consent).

However note that you do not have to use the product, you can refund it, so arguing this is a massive violation of human rights isn't going to fly. Should you bring this case to your local data protection agency, they will first try to reach an agreement between you and the company that fulfills both sides interests. Note: no matter what the contract says your local agency is there to supports you as a first responder. The company will likely have to show some improvement, at best an actual consent checkbox, at least a change of the bad form.

If you actually go there you should wiretap the device and bring evidences what data the company collects. If it turns out to be a lot more than reasonable (id of the camera, time, gps locations, frames of the content) and the company is not cooperating, then the claws come out and its fining time. However if it turns out to be harmless, pseudonymous and processed to high standards, then the agency will ask you if you can accept that and saying no will turn into a lot of work in front of a court.

Disclaimer: i am not a layer and this is just laymen talk about my opinion about how things are.