News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by mabbo on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:30PM (#30533453)
A long time ago, I was a dev in Amazon's fulfillment org, and one day a lot of very smart people disappeared. The guy who had done some incredible pioneering work in computer vision for the warehouses; the only principal engineer the org had at the time; and a bunch of other people I know that we're just really clever people. And they joined an org called "JIHM". What's JIHM? They'll only tell you if you join. But it's going to be really cool. (I was in Toronto so I couldn't join- Seattle only).

What I knew: these particular people had left for this project. The head of it was the guy who had lead the Kindle project- he had rejoined Amazon allegedly because Jeff asked him to lead this project. And for whatever reason, this JIHM org had all these new physical book store managers reporting up to them.

Over lunch one day, I proposed a theory to my coworker: "they're going to make that IBM commercial from the 90s, where the sketchy dude grabs a bunch of stuff and puts it in his pockets, then just walks out the door and gets a receipt". It was a fun idea, and given the CV people they had pulled it may have even made sense. "What about the book stores?" My friend asked "It's a smoke screen. That same guy leading JIHM is legendary for leaking false reports that Amazon was going to build a PC to cover him hiring hardware engineer for the Kindle."

6 months later, Amazon Go with it's 'Just Walk Out' technology was publicly announced. The CV guy I knew was even in the commercial ("Holy shit, is that Danny?!").

Maybe this is the final conclusion that those stores were just a cover.

(Caveat: this is all wild speculation, rumours, and probably bad memory on my part, but it's a great story and I swear it's all true!)

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by qwerpy on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:49PM (#30534476)
I had a very similar experience there. A mysterious 4 letter acronym that made no sense even if you knew what it stood for. "Multi-billion dollar market!". Wouldn't tell me what it was until I joined. Above average team from internal transfers ("our hiring standards are way above Amazon's regular bar!") and external hires. I even got smugly booted from a team meeting where I had presented some code I had written, after some SDE 2 realized I hadn't yet signed the NDA or whatever.

It ended up being Kindle ads for Amazon Local, the now defunct Groupon clone. So anti-climactic after all the cloak and daggers theatrics. At least Amazon Go is a much bigger deal with interesting tech behind it.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by bobsil1 on Thursday March 03, 2022 @12:04AM (#30537355)
This is like when young Google bragged their receptionists had PhDs.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by morganslaw on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:33PM (#30533497)
Is Amazon Go stores sticking around? It is confusing when they say "all physical stores" are closing, but even the Amazon Go ones?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by meowkit on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:51PM (#30533704)
Amazon Go is being absorbed/rebranded under Amazon Fresh, which is supposedly like Whole Foods lite/their delivery service.

Might be wrong, this is just my observation in SEA/what I recall.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by mikepurvis on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:21PM (#30534060)
I was an intern at Amazon in Seattle in 2008 and was ordering groceries and beer from Fresh. It looks like it's a pretty big deal now in most major US cities, but I remember being surprised that year after year after year it seemed to just.... continue existing. Not going huge, but also not getting canned.

On the other hand, maybe that's the real lesson of Grocery Gateway and "dot coms" who tried to do a hard burn on this back in the day— it's a really hard thing to get right, and getting it right requires an extremely long horizon of slow and steady growth.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by mabbo on Thursday March 03, 2022 @02:35AM (#30538196)
For a long time, Fresh did not directly make a profit. That wasn't it's purpose.

The goal of Amazon fresh was to say "hey UPS! Looks like we can do deliveries all by ourselves without you! Give us a better deal or we'll become your competitor". Because all those deliveries were on Amazon trucks.

Then one day Amazon's delivery needs scaled beyond what UPS was willing to take on. And so Amazon Logistics became a major thing.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by xdeepak81 on Thursday March 03, 2022 @05:14PM (#30547768)
Amazon logistics actually started first in India because India was an unorganized section and there was no other company that can support Amazon. Almost every startup in India had to make their own logistic network.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by Breza on Friday March 04, 2022 @12:58PM (#30558064)
The local Whole Foods closed years ago due to a rat infestation and a lease dispute. They just reopened as the first "just walk out" Whole Foods. I imagine a lot of the Amazon Go energy will be going into more of the existing Whole Foods stores. If I worked at Whole foods right now, I'd be updating my resume for the day the robots come.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by WalterBright on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:33PM (#30534245)
> Amazon Go is being absorbed

Resistance is futile.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by strulovich on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:54PM (#30533733)
Looks like they might go away as Amazon merges the technology into Whole Foods:

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/technology/whole-foods-am...

(Sorry for paywalled article)

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by mabbo on Thursday March 03, 2022 @02:39AM (#30538226)
I hope so. It's honestly the coolest tech I've experienced in a while. It's invisible but a great UX.

From what I've read, today it's so expensive in terms of hardware that it's probably a money pit. But hardware gets cheaper, software gets more efficient, and eventually this stuff will just be in every store.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by colinmhayes on Thursday March 03, 2022 @12:54PM (#30544259)
They're bringing the amazon go tech to Whole Foods. Just started rolling out this week, I've got a feeling the timing here is not coincidental.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by angarg12 on Thursday March 03, 2022 @04:47AM (#30539069)
I was under NDA for that stupid robot that was announced recently. Had to bite my tongue for 3 years until I could tell people about that silly secret project.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by silisili on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:41PM (#30533573)
Thanks for sharing. Any inclination on what JIHM actually stood/stands for?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by zerocrates on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @06:07PM (#30534711)
The "IHM" is reported as "inventory health management," but I'm not sure about the "J." Bloomberg reported it as being an intentionally boring acronym/expansion.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-07-18/amazon-s-...

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by dylan604 on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @09:53PM (#30536551)
Jeff's Inventory Health Management?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by iamsomewalrus on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @11:50PM (#30537286)
Not sure what the J was for. Internally it’s been IHM since I joined. “Inventory Health Management” is a backronym. I won’t spill the - albeit boring - beans on where IHM actually comes from.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by zerocrates on Thursday March 03, 2022 @01:04AM (#30537717)
Yeah it does have the backronym flavor to it so that tracks.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by wizzwizz4 on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @04:54PM (#30533735)
JIHM is JIHM's interesting hidden meaning.

(not true)

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by elephantgambit on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:36PM (#30534281)
A combination of the closing stores' code names (neither relate to the actual projects very much).
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by mabbo on Thursday March 03, 2022 @02:40AM (#30538236)
I still have no idea.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by uejfiweun on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:02PM (#30533828)
That's an interesting story, thanks for sharing. It strikes me that when Amazon decides to commit to a product, they rarely fail. They've had success in innovating with Alexa, AWS, Kindle, etc. So hopefully they will have similar success with this tech, and hopefully it will be sold to third parties. I think the post-checkout future sounds awesome and convenient, and I look forward to it.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by vidarh on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:49PM (#30534469)
The post checkout future is delivery from robotic warehouses with ordering systems that predicts your weekly shop. I have hardly been to a grocery store for years, and some weeks I don't bother logging in to adjust my order.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by uejfiweun on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @07:26PM (#30535457)
Isn't this kind of risky though? Do you ever get bad produce or damaged goods?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by vidarh on Thursday March 03, 2022 @05:44AM (#30539412)
If I get anything bad they refund it no questions asked, but it's exceedingly rare. In ~4-5 years of weekly deliveries the worst damage I've had have been a couple of incidents of things like yoghurt pots etc. with thin film tops that have accidentally gotten pierced. I think if I ordered lots of produce I might consider doing that via one of the specialist delivery options, but it's never been a problem for me.

The biggest "risk" for my use has been that Ocado's predictive pre-filling of my weekly order is just good enough that I've gotten complacent about checking the orders, but it's not quite perfect, so if I miss the deadline, I might occasionally get stuff I didn't need (this is optional functionality - you can just place orders when you need them too and you can tweak what is included to have more control).

Ocado, the company in question is licensing various parts of their tech stack. E.g. in the US they've licensed to Kroger (which also took a 5% stake): https://www.businessinsider.com/ocado-kroger-amazon-online-g...

Between that, and the option of (more expensive) rapid deliveries from takeaway delivery companies like Deliveroo, or from the multiple different 15-minute grocery delivery companies, grocery stores just seems like a nuisance to me at this point. Of course my judgement is influenced by the fact that I don't have a car so not needing to drag shopping on foot or bus makes the leap in convenience far more significant than for a lot of people.

Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by colinmhayes on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:17PM (#30534012)
Why would they buy whole foods if they're just going to sell their competitive advantage to their competitors?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by MathCodeLove on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:25PM (#30534109)
Why would they invest in such great infrastructure for amazon.com if they're just going to sell that infrastructure to competitors?
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by colinmhayes on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:32PM (#30534228)
Because they make more money selling ads than they do selling their own products? Can't sell the ads unless merchants are using the marketplace though. Whole foods isn't necessary to sell the camera tech to competitors.
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by Uehreka on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @05:38PM (#30534308)
Is that even true though? I thought they frequently copied merchants’ products as Amazon Basics if they were selling well? Because if that’s true, it means they’d rather have the business themselves than advertise for someone else (at least in some categories).
Re:Amazon to close all of its physical bookstores and '4-sta... by jacobr1 on Wednesday March 02, 2022 @06:41PM (#30535087)
Or they incentivize/empower teams to find revenue without an overarching strategy, and then periodically rationalize what they have.