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Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by marttt on Friday February 25, 2022 @02:31AM (#30464562)
Former journalist from Estonia here. Our media republished a 1994 speech given by late president of Estonia Lennart Meri at a banquet in Hamburg, Germany. Vladimir Putin, a then internationally unknown politician from St Petersburg, was also among the listeners -- and demonstratively walked out of the room during Meri's speech, as reported by Deutsche Welle [1]. Quoting DW:

"On February 25, 1994, Putin was also in attendance. One distinguished guest, then-President of Estonia Lennart Meri, gave a speech. Putin did something that has never happened at this ceremony: he got up and left. "With his legs straight [ed.: in a marching stance], throwing a contemptuous glance at the host, he left the hall, every step accompanied by the creaking of the parquet," according to a correspondent for the German magazine Zeit. "His exit was followed by whispers. Who is he? What's his problem?"

What exactly did Meri say that so annoyed Putin? The speech reads like a prophecy of what happened 20 years later in Crimea. And Putin's reaction shows that he sent a clear signal to the West.

The Estonian president referred to a paper from the foreign ministry in Moscow: "It notes that the problem of ethnic Russian groups in countries neighboring Russia cannot be solved by diplomatic means alone." Other means were conceivable for Moscow, Meri concluded. He warned against Russia's "neo-imperialist policy" and appealed to integrate Eastern European countries, including Ukraine, into the "democratic world."

Lennart Meri was a former filmmaker, literary translator, writer and IMO a world class intellectual with excellent speeches. For anyone interested, I google-translated this Hamburg 1994 speech to English [2]. The original source in Estonian is also present on the homepage of President's Office [3].

1: https://www.dw.com/en/vladimir-putins-infamous-history-in-ha...

2: https://zerobin.net/?5938a7875752194a#kVyn/9uj46bUH+M1z7rk+w...

3: https://vp1992-2001.president.ee/est/k6ned/K6ne.asp?ID=4236

Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by paganel on Friday February 25, 2022 @04:31AM (#30465346)
To be fair Estonia's treatment of its Russian community fed right into Putin's propaganda machine, when you still have this: "7.3% are "persons with undetermined citizenship"" (to quote wikipedia [1]) ~30 years after the break-up of the USSR then you know something was not done right on Estonia's part when it came to really integrating the Russian community. The same partially goes for the condition of the Russian community in Ukraine, especially recently. This is of course not a discussion that we can have right now, in a neuter manner, so to speak, because there's a war just close to us (I'm from Romania myself), but going forward the people involved will have to look back and see when things starting going adrift.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russians_in_Estonia

Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by trymas on Friday February 25, 2022 @05:16AM (#30465652)
AFAIK like in Latvia - these people (mostly russians) had (and still have) 3 choices: go back to russia, apply for citizenship or be left as "non-citizen".

If after ~30 years after break-up of USSR you have not gone back to russia (because quality of life in Estonia or Latvia is probably better), or have not learned the language or do not want to pledge loyalty to the country - then such person is a problem to itself. My social anecdotal bubble tells me that most of such people are very pro-soviet-union, but somehow idea of moving back to "mother russia" scares them.

Also in most post-soviet states russian communities can live all their lives without learning local language, i.e. there are native-russian kindergartens, schools, even university programs, russian entertainment and they can expect and be able to communicate almost everywhere in russian. So where's the bad treatment?

Putin's propaganda machine will make shit up on the spot - treatment of russian speaking communities is one of them. Maybe you also believe that there's fascist junta in Ukraine or Estonia? russian troll industry are masters of fake news - that will flood everything with multiple bullshit statements.

Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by paganel on Friday February 25, 2022 @05:42AM (#30465807)
> then such person is a problem to itself.

No, that is a statement that I consider false. I do personally live in a country that has a sizeable ethnic minority (Hungarians/Szekely, depending on the particular region of the country where they live [1]), and many of them do not know the local/national language, which is Romanian. Many of my fellow citizens regard that as almost blasphemy, I (and the law itself) actually have the contrary view, those people have the same right to Romanian citizenship as I do, even if they don't/can't speak the Romanian language.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarians_in_Romania

Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by pedrosorio on Saturday February 26, 2022 @01:42AM (#30475642)
Perhaps the difference is that the historical relationship, and power differential, between Romania and Hungary is not exactly the same as the one between the Baltic States and Russia.
Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by marttt on Friday February 25, 2022 @05:46AM (#30465829)
True, the integration of the Russian minority has been a three-decade long political struggle in Estonia.
Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by dmitriid on Friday February 25, 2022 @06:55AM (#30466308)
Key word: propaganda.

While statelessness in the Baltic countries is a very controversial issue, I don't believe it'sas bad as people are making it out to be.

The absolute vast majority of those people don't care about the situation: they can work, they can travel through the EU and other countries, and they can play the victim card.

As a good example, Nils Ušakovs was the mayor of Riga, and his parents were stateless (and hi mother probably still is [1]). So its not like statelessness affects people other than the actual person (and the degree to which it affects them is very debatable).

[1] https://voxeurop.eu/en/a-russian-in-charge-in-riga/

Re:Chernobyl power plant captured by Russian forces by cormacrelf on Friday February 25, 2022 @02:40AM (#30464614)
Interesting! A bit of an echo happened yesterday: there was a big walkout at the OSCE meeting, before Belarus and Russia started to speak.

https://twitter.com/rikardjozwiak/status/1496913193360400387

https://twitter.com/ger_osce/status/1496917994559066117?s=21