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Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by darzu on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:05PM (#30184738)
> Our team is a Seattle-based reduced-hours team. We don't work Fridays!

FYI, in case anyone else has a hard time finding what exactly the hours reduction is.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by ar_lan on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:58PM (#30185374)
From what I've heard of working at Amazon, this sounds like most likely you are expected to still put in the standard 80hrs/week, just cram it into Mo-Thurs (or maybe Sat-Thurs).

I find it reallllly hard to trust Amazon when it comes to working less. This really just sounds like a way to get someone to work the same amount for less pay (I assume the position has a paycut).

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by tasha0663 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @06:48PM (#30186069)
> As an Engineer on the Developer Platform team, you will be contributing to the design and development of the end-to-end developer experience across all 50+ teams

In other words, when the janky build tools someone wrote >10 years ago break down, you're going to be on-call so much that you'll just run a landline into the back of your head, Matrix style.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by commandlinefan on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:40PM (#30185136)
Sounds like a trap to me - in theory, most programming jobs "don't" work Saturdays or Sundays or after 6 PM either. On paper, anyway.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by rco8786 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:52PM (#30185290)
Rather cynical. You're basically just assuming everything they say about the job must be a lie.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by EarlKing on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:59PM (#30185393)
Having worked for Amazon before I'd say that's a fairly safe assumption.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by drunkpotato on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:57PM (#30185370)
Sounds more like experienced than cynical to me. In my experience, job descriptions and even the answers you get during interviews are not so much outright lies, as aspirational fabrications you have to take with a grain of salt.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by femto113 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:54PM (#30185325)
I'm guessing you haven't worked for Amazon.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by throwaway7033 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @08:28PM (#30187132)
Job descriptions are forward looking statements; the position may be entirely different.

Here are some of the many possibilities:

The service has poor uptime and you're on call every weekend.

Schedule pressure or poor management means that you're asked to come in on Fridays "until the next release".

The reduced-hours position was sponsored by a VP who has lost interest or left the company. Your direct manager has deadlines to meet and pressures you into working full-time.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by michaelcampbell on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @07:15PM (#30186393)
"Foresight is often mistaken as cynicism by those that do not have it."
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by dragonwriter on Saturday February 12, 2022 @03:20PM (#30315995)
Assuming that Amazon is a profit-maximizing corporation that will fully exploit it's human resources to the extent possible, and that forward-looking but non-binding statements cannot be relied on to limit that might be called cynicism but to me it looks a lot like realism.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by krageon on Thursday February 03, 2022 @05:27AM (#30190790)
Amazon became big on lies, and in fact is in the news frequently because it continues to do so.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by hoseja on Thursday February 03, 2022 @05:43AM (#30190871)
Corporations exploit the benefit of the doubt. It mustn't be extended to them.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by chana_masala on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:53PM (#30185311)
I'd say it's evidence based skepticism
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by robbrown451 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:54PM (#30185332)
I know that's the popular cynical view, but I'd think with such a position (especially given that it was advertised as reduced hours), there would be 20% lower expectations as to what you'll accomplish. In other words, they'd expect it would take five weeks for you to do what someone else can do in four.

I mean, that's all they have to determine/enforce how much you time you put in currently... general expectations.

Some people say you work the hours needed to get the job done, but that doesn't really make sense. Somehow the work the company needs to get accomplished gets divided up and distributed to employees. And ultimately you've got to think of how much is reasonable to accomplish. Here, that expectation of reasonableness is going to get reduced by about 20% if they are hired to work that many less hours.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by scarby2 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @06:22PM (#30185700)
there have been many studies that show that people who consistently work less hours are more productive per hour. generally going from 40 hours to 32 hours i'd be surprised if the difference in productivity was more than 5-10% (it may even be positive).
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by SkyPuncher on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @06:16PM (#30185604)
Besides being a founder, I've never had a programming job that's required such outside of mostly rare incident responses.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by romanovcode on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:56PM (#30185350)
Who works on Fridays anyway?
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by ipaddr on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @07:42PM (#30186698)
I work harder than ever on Fridays. Mondays I get nothing done.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by linguistiliniw on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @10:01PM (#30187982)
Cool that they're still doing this.

IIRC it was in a trial period pre-pandemic. The impression I got was that they wanted to test a 4-day week, but worried it would be disruptive if only one or two team members were out on Fridays. Hence, 4-day teams.

Amazon gets a bad rap, but it can be a nice place to work as a developer. The overtime and pressure varies wildly from team to team, and you'd have to figure that people who choose to join a 4/3 team aren't the sort to press deadlines.

This listing looks like it is for a position which supports their internal developers and/or retail site. Those systems are probably fairly mature, so maybe it's a good business move to hire people to keep them running on a slow burn with better work/life balance.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by dheera on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:27PM (#30184986)
Is the salary also reduced or only the hours? Too bad they don't give a probability distribution of salaries for the position ...
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by civilized on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:41PM (#30185148)
The salary is reduced but the actual hours you put in stay the same.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by smashem on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:53PM (#30185315)
4 weeks of primary on-call.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by dheera on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @08:34PM (#30187186)
On-call needs to be legally optional and compensated.

I for one get serious heart symptoms if I don't have adequate sleep.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by softwarebeware on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:35PM (#30185084)
We know that Amazon has a max salary of $160,000 or some such
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by WaxProlix on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:40PM (#30185129)
Technically true, in Seattle, but a large portion of comp comes in RSUs above that mark. You can see on levels.fyi that new hires in the 5-10 YOE range are getting total comps in the 3 or 400s pretty consistently.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by CobrastanJorji on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:45PM (#30185196)
Yes, which is a problem. Amazon employees have been watching themselves get steady, significant raises via stock vesting for years, but AMZN flattened out in mid-2020 and the company's done very little to account for that, so everybody's raises have started to dry up.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by petilon on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:52PM (#30185291)
Amazon employees get RSUs. The difference between stock options and RSUs is that options are worthless if the stock price doesn't go up, but RSUs are worth the stock price, so it doesn't have to go up, it just needs to not drop.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by qqtt on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @08:32PM (#30187176)
> so it doesn't have to go up, it just needs to not drop.

Amazon compensation packages assume 15% increase in RSU value year over year, so when you get a 4 year grant as a new hire, your target compensation will be projected based off 15% year over year growth, which typically means less stock granted in year 4 compared to year 3.

With a stagnant stock price, many Amazon employees are potentially at risk of not hitting their year 3 target compensation.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by Rebelgecko on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @09:49PM (#30187887)
I've heard that when AMZN goes up, Amazon will actually take that into account and reduce your refreshers
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by WaxProlix on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:55PM (#30185338)
I'm definitely aware of that. Amazon's comp was never competitive, and stagnant (or even declining) stock over a multi-year period exacerbates the issue for sure. I say this as someone who recently left AWS, in large part for comp related issues (actually kinda loved the job I eventually fell into, alas).
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by burnoot on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @09:04PM (#30187482)
I’m not sure whether everyone else is getting poorly paid at Amazon, or whether my clique is just doing well, but I’ve found that my salary is (was) in line with the higher end of the market. The declining/flat stock price changes that though. I know quite a few Amazonians looking to leave once their two years are up*

* Amazon pay a signing bonus for the first two years in lieu of RSUs. The idea is that you could sell your RSUs to make up the difference. The problem is that, for anyone who started in the last two years, your RSUs won’t make up the difference between your base salary and what you were getting as a bonus.

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by WaxProlix on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @11:25PM (#30188663)
Market has gone up, too - if you're a recent hire, your comp targets are actually above those of your seniors. As an incoming L4 you can make up to 200k now, whereas 140 or 150 was considered 'good' 5 or 6 years ago. L6s who are pulling in mid 3s can leave and get 5-600k elsewhere very easily. It's not that the amazon money is bad per se, just that the industry and talent market are kind of crazy right now.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by freyr on Thursday February 03, 2022 @03:44AM (#30190171)
L6 at Amazon is two levels up from the bottom (“senior engineer”)? Where are they making $500k-$600k a year?

From levels.fyi, FAANG and the unicorns are almost all in the $300k-$400k range. Have offers gone up $200k in the last few months? Or are you assuming people are moving up a level?

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by WaxProlix on Thursday February 03, 2022 @06:33PM (#30200591)
It's true actually, levels shows them topping out at ~400, but I personally know a few who are well above that.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by comp_throw7 on Friday February 04, 2022 @04:19PM (#30213389)
https://www.levels.fyi/company/Amazon/salaries/Software-Engi...

If you filter by "New Offers Only", you'll see a pretty sharp shift in the trend starting around October 2021.

Same with Uber, a notable uptick starting late last year: https://www.levels.fyi/company/Uber/salaries/Software-Engine...

The top of the band has probably gone up more than the median offer, and most companies didn't increase their bands by that much (yet). This is definitely a case of "the future is here - just not evenly distributed yet".

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by freyr on Saturday February 12, 2022 @03:09PM (#30315900)
Still, extremely few in the claimed range, even after October.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by nijave on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @06:33PM (#30185844)
A lot of places are issuing RSUs based on cash value, not set share quantity.

If stock goes down, you end up getting more shares and vice versa but the $ stays the same

It's basically just regular bonuses tied to tenure

Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by synergy20 on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:57PM (#30185363)
nay Amazon SW is very demanding as far as I can tell(many friends work there), yes it has higher pay but if you divide it by hours, it's not standing out above other companies at all. have a life.
Re:Reduced-hours software development engineer position at A... by hwers on Wednesday February 02, 2022 @05:33PM (#30185057)
Hey that's not too bad really. Less than a 4 day work week and things might get boring.