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Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by tempestn on Saturday January 15, 2022 @07:58PM (#29952183)
I've hypothesized that a unique problem with unhealthy eating habits compared to other addictions is that you have to eat. I would think at least with something like alcohol or nicotine, what you need to do as an addict is fairly simple (which of course is different from easy). But you can't just cut out food entirely, so it's a much more complex issue trying to eat in a healthy manner. Especially since even being too restrictive and structured can be a problem as well. Do you think there's anything to that?
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by rrrrrrrrrrrryan on Sunday January 16, 2022 @02:17AM (#29954094)
It'd be near impossible to become obese (or remain obese) if you just cut out sugar and processed foods. Nobody ends up in an electric scooter by pigging out on vegetables and chicken breasts. If you want to get shredded you'll have to do much more, of course, but if you just want to look and feel like a normal weight human, it really doesn't have to be any more complex.

Just as many alcoholics can't handle a glass of wine with dinner or a beer with a friend on a Friday night, many food addicts just can't handle sugar or fast food at all, and would be better off cutting these things out of their lives entirely. It's a more hardcore lifestyle change, but it can also be a psychologically simpler ruleset to follow.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by shakes_mcjunkie on Sunday January 16, 2022 @10:58AM (#29956990)
> It's a more hardcore lifestyle change, but it can also be a psychologically simpler ruleset to follow.

It's a hardcore change but "simple" to follow? Isn't that part of the problem? The physical and mental are tightly interwoven. Telling someone they should just eat vegetables and chicken breasts ignores all of the other problems, mental and physical, that could be leading someone to unhealthy habits. In fact, a "ruleset" like this could contribute to further psychological problems and then further physical problems. This is the issue with diets, they ignore all the other factors outside of food.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by SamPatt on Saturday January 15, 2022 @08:37PM (#29952429)
You can cut out entire categories of food or drink though. People drink way more calories than they realize. Drink water instead of soda.

It's definitely hard but the "just say no" approach can work. I do recommend taking it one at a time though. Once you've cut out one thing successfully, add another.

I lost 90 lbs with this approach.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by cbsmith on Sunday January 16, 2022 @06:36AM (#29955147)
Totally does not work for me. It doesn't help that I figured out the "drinking calories" problem a long time ago and mostly drank water already. Cutting things out just seems to lead to eating more of others, because the problem isn't what food I eat.

It's harder, but the biggest trick was learning to pay attention to what my body was telling me, stop when it first gave me a sign to stop, don't start until it gave me a signal to start, and also... realizing that if you're obese (as opposed to an underweight person with an eating disorder), that maybe spending a part of your day feeling hungry is a sign that you are taking care of yourself. That sounds pretty simple too when you write it out like that, but my goodness just doing that is a so hard (yet effective).

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by medstrom on Sunday January 16, 2022 @07:29AM (#29955452)
> maybe spending a part of your day feeling hungry is a sign that you are taking care of yourself.

Yes - may as well feel positive associations with hunger.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by hallway_monitor on Saturday January 15, 2022 @10:13PM (#29952902)
Second this. Setting simple rules is the only way I've been able to make consistent change. No soda. No bread. One at a time. I'm probably down only 20 pounds from my max but I feel so much healthier.
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by nexuist on Saturday January 15, 2022 @08:16PM (#29952301)
Well, one of the problems with alcohol and nicotine is that you also can't just cut them out entirely. Withdrawal symptoms are brutal and not compatible with modern 40 hour week jobs. Cutting out food, especially sugary ones, probably would bring about some subset of the same withdrawal symptoms...so the problems are more closely related than they appear, IMO (disclaimer that I have never been addicted to either so I may be completely off).
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by wyclif on Sunday January 16, 2022 @12:30AM (#29953673)
Sure, if you stop you're going to struggle against withdrawal symptoms. As far as nicotine goes, the good news is that if you can stop for a week, the temptation dramatically decreases. If you can stop for two weeks, the residual nicotine has completely left the body and you shouldn't be feeling withdrawal symptoms. If you can be disciplined for just two weeks, you can kick the habit.
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by seadan83 on Sunday January 16, 2022 @01:18PM (#29958400)
It took me 7 years to quit nicotine. The first two weeks were the toughest and every minute my mind was screaming at me to go smoke. The next three months were still constant cravings, all the time, all day. After six months cravings were once a day and easier to let go. The entire first six months were difficult.

It wasn't until about two years later until I would have several days without cravings.

10 years later, I get cravings maybe once every few months and they are easy to let go of. Two days ago I got into a Lyft and someone dropped a pack of cigarettes in the back seat. The temptation was moderate to take them.

I think in part the brain hardwires to confuse nicotine as a type of food. Do not eat for two days, and that is what a smoker feels like for the first 2 weeks. Do not eat fir a day and that is what the first 3 months felt like (all the time, constantly). Your mind is telling you that you will literally die if you don't resolve the urge.

I think this is why relapse is so high for nicotine. You have to be consistently strong every time for months to almost be hone free. During that 7 years I had relapses usually after days, a few times I made it a week or two, once I went 3 months, and had gone 6 months twice as well before relapse.

FWIW, a person just has to keep trying. I admitted that 1) I deeply loved smoking. It is amazing. 2) there is no such thing as one last cigarette. Relapse would likely occur, and when that happens, my cessation efforts would continue.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by cbsmith on Sunday January 16, 2022 @06:41AM (#29955169)
Most of the physical consequences of nicotine go away within a couple of weeks. There's a never ending psychological battle, but that is pretty compatible with holding down a job. Find a way to get two weeks off at once if you have to.

As for alcohol, I'll just say that as incompatible as withdrawal is with holding down a job... being drunk is pretty incompatible too. I think if you can finesse one, you can probable finesse the other.

In general, my observation has been that as horrible as withdrawal is, that's the easiest part of kicking a habit.

Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by tempestn on Saturday January 15, 2022 @08:18PM (#29952317)
I was mostly thinking over the longer term.
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by hammock on Saturday January 15, 2022 @08:47PM (#29952477)
There is no long term when it comes to compulsions
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by tempestn on Sunday January 16, 2022 @05:40PM (#29961116)
My point is that once you've managed to quit, what you need to do is simple: not have any. Doesn't mean it's easy, as there are still compulsions. But with food you can't do that—you still need to eat.
Re:The Zen of Drinking Alone by enaaem on Sunday January 16, 2022 @05:03AM (#29954714)
One way to cut calories is to go fasting. Either you eat or you don’t eat all. It’s easier to control your urges compared to eating smaller meals.