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Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by Dylan16807 on Tuesday November 16, 2021 @08:12AM (#29240109)
> FWIW this is completely up to the CPU. "Classical" ECC is completely transparent to the DIMM, it just remembers and returns what the CPU gave to it.

True, but I guess I assumed normal ECC was standardized. Is it?

> 32 → 40 has already been around for quite some time (particularly when the DDR controller only has 64 data lines but you still want ECC

Is that keeping a burst length of 8 on DDR3/DDR4? One thing to consider is that a full memory transfer plus 16 extra bits is much more useful than a smaller transfer with 8 extra bits. That could easily be a tipping point from "not worth bothering" to "they really should do something here".

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by eqvinox on Tuesday November 16, 2021 @11:15AM (#29242276)
> True, but I guess I assumed normal ECC was standardized. Is it?

This is outside my area of expertise, but I believe everyone just does the same thing without it being a standard. (Especially since even CPU vendors frequently just buy a done-and-tested DDR controller design.)

> Is that keeping a burst length of 8 on DDR3/DDR4?

All the "classical" ECC just uses additional data lines, and I assumed DDR5 would do the same thing. I hadn't checked until a minute ago, but yes, DDR5 (like previous versions) just extends the width of the data bus by the ECC bits.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by Dylan16807 on Tuesday November 16, 2021 @02:20PM (#29245185)
> All the "classical" ECC just uses additional data lines

I know that. But DDR5, at least under normal use, increases the number of bits sent across each data line in a single memory access. So now you have 16 spare bits across the entire thing, instead of just 8. This means that even if you had 32->40 ECC before, the value you could extract from the extra bits goes up a lot with DDR5.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by eqvinox on Wednesday November 17, 2021 @12:26PM (#29255962)
Oh, sorry, I misunderstood. I don't think any implementation does that, since it would require holding back the entire burst in a buffer in the DDR controller. Which would significantly impact performance through the added latency.

But honestly I don't know — and also this seems like if some vendor wanted to take (or not take) the performance hit for extra safety, they could well deviate from everyone else.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by Dylan16807 on Wednesday November 17, 2021 @06:04PM (#29260016)
To be 100% safe, it would add latency to part of the reads. Though not much compared to the normal speed of a memory access.

To be 99% safe you could send a signal a couple nanoseconds late that says "wait, this data is bad, you should abort".

It also might make writes a bit more awkward.