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Re:Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers by tdeck on Monday July 26, 2021 @01:20AM (#27955966)
I wondered this too when learning Pinyin. I believe the reason is that while Pinyin's X and Q may sound like "sh" and "ch" to English speakers, they are actually different sounds (and contrast with the "sh" and "ch" sounds that also exist in Mandarin). That said, I still wonder why -ui was chosen for "wei", "shi" is pronounced "shr", "-ian" is pronounced "yen", etc...

MPS-II seems much closer to intuitive pronunciation for English speakers, although it never caught on: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandarin_Phonetic_Symbols_II

Re:Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers by squiggleblaz on Monday July 26, 2021 @04:41PM (#27965179)
> I believe the reason is that while Pinyin's X and Q may sound like "sh" and "ch" to English speakers, they are actually different sounds (and contrast with the "sh" and "ch" sounds that also exist in Mandarin).

Neither Mandarin sh nor x exist in English. X is sharper and is a little more like shy-, whereas sh is darker and a little like shr-. In reality they both strike English speakers as being quite like sh, because we use the space differently.

I've heard various native English speakers who are fluent in Mandarin saying e.g. Xi as Si. I don't know if there's a dialectal difference in English or in Mandarin or both that accounts for it.

> That said, I still wonder why -ui was chosen for "wei"

It looks better, if you have a certain aesthetic.

> "shi" is pronounced "shr"

As far as I know Mandarin speakers just consider them the same. Pinyin is designed for native speakers.

> "-ian" is pronounced "yen"

The e in Pinyin isn't really the English e sound. It's more like the American short u in fun or the NZ short i in pin. It's not obvious what letter to use to represent that, but e is not completely unreasonable. When they do have an e-sound according to the internal logic of Mandarin, it's a variant of an a-sound.

Re:Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers by Markoff on Monday July 26, 2021 @04:02AM (#27956867)
> That said, I still wonder why -ui was chosen for "wei", "shi" is pronounced "shr"

Shi is pronounced Shr? That sounds more like your typical pirate Beijing hua. Which can get quite confusing when you get out of Beijing to let's say to Shanghai business trip and you can't figure if something cost 4 or 10 kuai at street vendor (my personal anecdote, I think they actually do it on purpose since normally 4 would have very different sound).

Re:Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers by loycombinate on Monday July 26, 2021 @01:38AM (#27956052)
A Chinese teacher once told me that pinyin is based off Russian
Re:Pronouncing non-English names for English speakers by bmn__ on Monday July 26, 2021 @12:18PM (#27961319)
That's more wrong than correct. There's only one minor part of the design where we can see a relation: Latin q resembles Cyrillic ч.