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Re:Valve Steam Deck by azinman2 on Thursday July 15, 2021 @04:12PM (#27849518)
Non-gamer here: what’s the point of these bots? Is there money as stake? Or just a leader chart? But if you get your bot to #1, but you’re not able to do anything with it and it’s a bot, what’s the incentive?
Re:Valve Steam Deck by KillahBhyte on Thursday July 15, 2021 @04:47PM (#27849933)
Depends a lot on the game. If there is nothing to be 'earned' by being competitively better then it is nothing more than street cred. Think simple games or older games. CS 1.6 before rewards, knifes, and skins. A small few players might make some comp scene to get to some incentive but most are ultimately found out.

The bigger issue, and I believe the primary reason for the rise in popularity of these bots, is when your performance does 'earn' you something. As the OP was speaking of TF2, this comes in the form of hats and custom weapons. Today's counterstrike game has weapon skins and knifes that go for pretty extreme real world dollars.

Almost every modern shooter has some sort of rank up system tied to rewards. Some of the worst examples would be PUBG's real world money trading of loot box items or Diablo 3's real world money auction house.

In my mind, these kind of systems turn video games meant for enjoyment into some weird NFT mining system where normal players are manually mining them with pen and paper while the bots have built ASIC devices.

In cases where the items themselves cannot be sold, you have people selling the whole accounts. There are entire middlemen businesses set up around this stuff. It's crazy but there is your primary driver for incentive.

Re:Valve Steam Deck by kllrnohj on Thursday July 15, 2021 @09:34PM (#27852185)
> Today's counterstrike game has weapon skins and knifes that go for pretty extreme real world dollars.

I don't know about TF2, but for CSGO weapon skins & knives (and all drops) never come from gameplay wins. So there's no motivation at all to cheat for any monetary-related reason. Botting was a thing to farm for drops, but those literally just joined a server and spun in place to avoid being AFK kicked - that's it.

So CSGO cheating is purely about the human interaction components (eg, feeling good about winning, taking pleasure in making people angry, the thrill of getting away with it, etc...)

Re:Valve Steam Deck by KillahBhyte on Friday July 16, 2021 @09:30AM (#27856024)
Gotcha. Haven't played CS since source so I wasn't sure. Are aimbots a common thing there nowadays? I don't remember seeing them much back in the day. Sure some of that is due to selection bias from good private owned servers. I would suspect that they exist but are not common.

On the other hand, PUBG does have Battle Point rewards linked to performance. And there it is very common. Almost guaranteed to see a cheater every 10 matches or so. And there was an easy means to sell those rewards. Contrast that against Sea of Thieves. A game specifically about PvP and stealing loot from other players. I don't know that I have ever encountered a cheater there. But there is very little incentive to do so. There just isn't many vectors to turn virtual work into real world profit.

Seems to me that the lower the barrier of entry together with the higher the real world value of the rewards\drops gives you a clear scale of the cheat potential\incentive\effort. I think there will always be a small percentage of those doing it for the LULZ. You can combat that by raising the barrier to entry. F2P games seem to have a higher rate of these types.

When the reward system cultivates an environment ripe for abuse, it moves from occasionally annoying to game killing epidemic.

Re:Valve Steam Deck by alliao on Thursday July 15, 2021 @06:31PM (#27850882)
China and it's 50k USD cap per capita restriction (probably lower and harder still now) practically become in infinite demand side pressure for these too.

They can buy players /cheat to farm, then sell the virtual goods over to those with USD; with healthy discount as profit for the other end. Thereby transfering their asset out of China.

Re:Valve Steam Deck by neaden on Thursday July 15, 2021 @04:27PM (#27849700)
For some people, causing frustration and annoyance in others is all the incentive they need. But in this case also, possibly hats.
Re:Valve Steam Deck by dkdbejwi383 on Thursday July 15, 2021 @04:52PM (#27849988)
Most of the TF2 bots seem to be about trolling. They just kill players, spam chat and voice, and some have racist names (because Valve don’t check for Unicode characters in player names)
Re:Valve Steam Deck by dolmen on Friday July 16, 2021 @06:37AM (#27854815)
Look at this 5 years old video that explains the economy of game cheating. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI7V60r7Jco
Re:Valve Steam Deck by andrewf on Thursday July 15, 2021 @06:26PM (#27850845)
Same reasons you'll see some kids (and some grown-ups) cheat at Monopoly or any other game.
Re:Valve Steam Deck by TchoBeer on Thursday July 15, 2021 @04:30PM (#27849741)
Some men just want to watch the world burn