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Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by gberger on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:06PM (#27160603)
What's the context?
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by echo419 on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:09PM (#27160621)
From: https://www.axios.com/apple-severs-ties-with-antonio-garcia-...

*Snip*

Context: News broke earlier this week that Apple had hired García Martínez for an unspecified role.

Apple did not say what exactly García Martínez' position was, but sources said he was hired for a lower-level engineering role and started last week.

In the petition, first reported by the Verge, employees write: "We demand an investigation into how his published views on women and people of color were missed or ignored, along with a clear plan of action to prevent this from happening again."

In one passage from "Chaos Monkeys," García Martínez describes women in the Bay Area as "soft and weak, cosseted and naive despite their claims of worldliness, and generally full of shit.”

This passage was also cited online when García Martínez started writing for Wired magazine.

*Snip*

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by mcguire on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:35PM (#27160791)
"A lower level engineering role" doesn't sound like a good description of a position for Facebook's "former director of Ad Exchange." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Garc%C3%ADa_Mart%C3%AD...)
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by barbazoo on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:25PM (#27160729)
> García Martínez describes women in the Bay Area as "soft and weak, cosseted and naive despite their claims of worldliness, and generally full of shit.”

Why on earth would anyone put something like that in a book?!

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by azinman2 on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:53PM (#27160911)
Because he was comparing the woman he was dating to his general experience.

You can look at the larger passage as important context. It’s easy to dismiss him still as a jerk, but what bothers me is the idea that one cannot have an authentic experience that isn’t totally whitewashed and ready to be used for an ad for a multinational.

Reading all of the selected quotes in that petition came off to me as thoughts he probably shouldn’t have published, but ones that many ordinary people have that aren’t total monsters. Yes he’s probably got a lot of toxic masculinity hold ups.. but so do millions and millions of people. If you read the minds of most employees at large companies and then put it into words, probably people would be fired left and right.

At some point we need to acknowledge personal thoughts aren’t always the same thing as professional interactions, and that people can also grow, learn and change.

He might not be the one for this, but I think the public response feels very snap for someone’s life. Probably almost no one signing that petition actually read his book or learned much about him in order to put things into context and perspective, yet they were easily wanting to ruin a man’s life.

NB Perhaps he deserves it, I don’t know. But I’m wanting to withhold judgement, and I don’t have enough time or cares to actually investigate him.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by philosopher1234 on Friday May 14, 2021 @08:37PM (#27161158)
Personal thoughts and NYT bestseller published thoughts are very distinct.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by meowfly on Saturday May 15, 2021 @06:46PM (#27169670)
This book came out at a time where people were lampooning the excesses of startup culture. (e.g Disrupted and HBO's Silicon Valley).

It's my opinion García Martínez thought he would capitalize on the trend and wrote a book describing his experience in a YCombinator company that was aquihired by Facebook.

He wrote himself as a character in that genre. His writing style in general, however, seems to give him away as a blowhard - which I don't think was was his intent.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by manicdee on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:41PM (#27160826)
Because there is an audience who will buy that book.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by spoonjim on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:32PM (#27160773)
Cause it makes the book sell.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by Cyberdog on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:20PM (#27160695)
A take biased in favor of Garcia-Martinez which argues he's not the monster he's being made out to be: https://taibbi.substack.com/p/on-the-hypocrites-at-apple-who...
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by alvah on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:56PM (#27160932)
That read like a reasonable summary to me. What makes you say it’s biased towards AGM?
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by Cyberdog on Friday May 14, 2021 @08:12PM (#27161036)
> What makes you say it’s biased towards AGM?

Well, partly because the author begins with:

> I’m biased, because I know Antonio Garcia-Martinez and something like the same thing once happened to me…

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by alvah on Saturday May 15, 2021 @11:31AM (#27166088)
He acknowledges this, but the article is hardly a hagiography.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by bingbingbong on Friday May 14, 2021 @08:00PM (#27160967)
The authour tends to write about this topic a lot. I found it more or less reasonable, but they no doubt have a bias.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by mcguire on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:32PM (#27160772)
If that's biased in his favor....
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by NovemberWhiskey on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:09PM (#27160625)
Latest storm in a teacup over a minor celebrity engineer getting let go from Apple after other employees discover his book has some misogynistic / ill-advised / heartfelt / probably-true (pick according to your convictions) opinions about SV women.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by slenk on Saturday May 15, 2021 @12:08AM (#27162268)
SV sure sounds like a hell hole to work in
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by mdeeks on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:07PM (#27160612)
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by infogulch on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:11PM (#27160634)
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by bsder on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:10PM (#27160630)
People willing to work on ad-tech are skeevy creeps.

Apple hired skeevy creep to work on ad-tech.

People got upset that Apple hired skeevy creep.

Apple fired/rescinded offer to skeevy creep.

Apple is likely about to pay a bunch of money to skeevy creep.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by philosopher1234 on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:20PM (#27160700)
why would they pay a bunch of money?
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by bsder on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:43PM (#27160834)
Employment is a contract. Apple broke that contract without reason from the individual.

If he resigned from another job and relocated, there are damages here that are quite easy to document.

Yes, employees are nominally "at-will", but employers don't get to just do anything they want without consequence--especially in California.

I'm surprised Apple did actually say anything beyond "We have terminated his employment. No further comment." as they're on terrible ground here.

Finally, unlike most small fry, he's not going to have any trouble finding a lawyer for this. Lawyers will happily take this obvious a case on retainer. And, he's got lots of "wokeness crusade" lawyers who will be salivating over this case.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by SpicyLemonZest on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:36PM (#27160794)
There's a legal theory known as "promissory estoppel" or "detrimental reliance" that probably applies if Martinez's story is accurate. Apple promised him a job, he made some major life changes based on that promise, and now they've withdrawn their promise without any relevant new information or new bad conduct on Martinez's part.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by manicdee on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:43PM (#27160837)
Apple can claim the information was new to them, such as for example believing the book was a work of satire only to find (based on post-hire discussion with AGM) it was actually a manifesto.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by SpicyLemonZest on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:50PM (#27160888)
They can. I'm skeptical whether that'd be true - although I guess it's really academic, because high-profile employment disputes like this are almost always settled out of court.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by diebeforei485 on Friday May 14, 2021 @11:44PM (#27162143)
Under California law, because he moved for this job.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by baby on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:08PM (#27160617)
There was a public outcry against Apple hiring him, as he wrote misogynistic things as part of some book. I only read the excerpt, which wasn’t great towards women. No idea if it was serious or what the whole book was about.
Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by gamblor956 on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:08PM (#27160616)
He's made a number of inappropriate (including some incredibly misogynistic) comments in his writings and online. A lot of Apple employees complained, and so he was fired before he even started.

Both sides are at fault here: AGM said some nasty things, and Apple failed to do its due diligence before recruiting him.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by gruez on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:10PM (#27160628)
>and Apple failed to do its due diligence before recruiting him.

Seems to be contradicted by the tweet?

>3. Apple was well aware of my writing before hiring me. My references were questioned extensively about my bestselling book and my real professional persona (rather than literary one).

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by compscistd on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:33PM (#27160780)
By "references" does he mean "cherry-picked people from my life who will say only good things about me"? No one I provide as a reference to a job at Apple is going to say something mean about me or a book they may or may not have even read. The only "due diligence" that seems to be demanded here is reading candidates' books (imagine a recruiter actually going through the effort of picking up a book and combing through all of it for just a single candidate) or looking through public social media posts (but the problematic ones may have likely only been shared in a private network).

I do think AGM's comments should disqualify him as a candidate to work in a diverse work environment. But I don't want hiring to be more exhausting than it already is on either side, so aren't situations like this the reason we have work at-will arrangements anyway? What could Apple really have done here to prevent this? "Sign here attesting that you haven't ever said anything that could point to you being a prejudiced person in the work environment". If it turns out you did say something pretty bad, then too bad you had to relocate for this job because the offer is withdrawn.

I'm sympathetic, I _know_ I've posted really stupid "edgy" things on social media some time between the ages of 12-15 that's likely buried in a set of redundant servers somewhere in the world. Stuff that would get me fired immediately if I said and believed them today. How do you convincingly demonstrate to an employer _and_ to your coworkers that the person from then isn't you anymore?

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by st-august on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:47PM (#27160859)
There's a difference between edgy social media comments from early adolescence -- which shouldn't be used to "cancel" anyone -- and passages from a book that this guy wrote and published when he was an adult (especially since he still hasn't retracted or apologized for anything that I'm aware of).

You make a good point about hiring, though. They could probably read reviews of his book, but I don't know whether the reviews would mention its sexist elements -- probably depends on when it was written.

Re:"I’ve kept silent on the Apple situation; they broke sile... by Aeolun on Friday May 14, 2021 @07:16PM (#27160666)
> Both sides are at fault here: AGM said some nasty things, and Apple failed to do its due diligence before recruiting him.

Since he wrote that ages before being hired, the only one at fault here is Apple. This is just a knee jerk reaction because of the backlash they got.