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Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by cutthegrass2 on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @08:52AM (#26955197)
The article briefly mentions RHR (resting heart rate) also. Anecdotally of course, but I notice my RHR being ~5 - 8 bpm lower when I abstain from alcohol for a few days.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by blunte on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:09AM (#26955340)
I have worn a Garmin watch with HR monitor for months at a time off and on for the last few years.

My resting heart rate while sleeping is typically 64-68 without alcohol and 65-85 after drinking several glasses of wine. There is such a marked difference in RHR in the two scenarios that you could tell if I drank simply by looking at my heart rate chart during the night.

Interestingly, I attempted to start running for one month about a year ago. My endurance is poor, but I would run/walk for several kilometers. Within the first week and continuing through that month, my RHR while sleeping was 52-62. Not only was it significantly lower, it took a long time after stopping exercise for the rate to return to what it usually is.

I don't know what this all really means, but it is fascinating. Studies or not, I imagine that not drinking + regular cardio exercise is better for long life than the alternative combinations.

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by chubot on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:47PM (#26958391)
Yup, I also noticed this. I wore a pulse oximeter every night which measures your heart rate, and it jumped from around 60 to 80 just because of alcohol one night. Crazy!

That was the biggest effect I saw by far, more than all the sleep apnea variables I was trying to measure!

Granted I don't drink often, and metabolize alcohol poorly, but still that's a huge difference.

FWIW I'm not out of shape; I commuted 1h / day by bike for over a decade, and was a medically normal weight, which is maybe 20-30th percentile in the population.

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by nradov on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @01:01PM (#26958578)
I also wear a Garmin watch with HR monitor. Having a couple glasses of wine with dinner doesn't seem to noticeably change my RHR while sleeping. There are probably differences between individuals.

An RHR that gets into the 85 range could indicate a cardiac problem. Might want to get that checked.

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by blunte on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @03:00PM (#26960004)
Probably due to _significant_ quantity of alcohol... and certainly not a good idea.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by tw04 on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @11:53AM (#26957631)
It just means you're out of shape and as you get into shape your HR reflects it. I saw similar after "summer of covid" and now getting back to running every day and limiting alcohol to once a week.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by sjg007 on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:11AM (#26955353)
Elite athletes have RHR in the 40s. Exercise improves the heart.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by clairity on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:49PM (#26958416)
be careful of the inverse inference though. a rhr in the 40s doesn’t necessarily mean you’re in good health. a low rhr could indicate a myriad of other cardiovascular issues (something of a personal concern for me).

but contrary to the article, an evening whiskey ~3 times a week (in my experience) seems to be optimal for delivering antiseptic benefits with few/no downsides.

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by batiudrami on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:12AM (#26955379)
I am fortunate enough to live in a country where we only had a lockdown for about 4 weeks of 2020, and during that time I didn't drink. See if you can see from my sleeping heart rate when that was: https://i.imgur.com/7VlYQ67.png
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by mannykannot on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:41AM (#26956527)
You appear to be demonstrating the opposite of what is claimed here: your heart-rate variability seems to have decreased when you were not drinking alcohol.

When I went back to the article to check this, however, I saw that, while the text says that alchohol has "a negative effect on HRV", and their model explains this, the diagram shows alcohol increasing the HRV. As the text's version of the observed results and its explanation for them are consistent, I assume the diagram is incorrectly labelled.

Update: Thanks to everyone for correcting me on what HRV means here.

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by enragedcacti on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:54AM (#26956739)
HRV is not a measure of change in your resting heart rate over time, its a measure of the difference on a per beat basis. Even if your BPM is 60, your heart doesn't beat exactly once a second, it will actually vary in length by some number of milliseconds back and forth. This is what is measured when talking about HRV.

It is believed to occur as the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous system "fight" over raising and lowering the heartrate. The symbiosis between them lands on a steady rate per minute with fluctuations on a per beat basis.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_rate_variability

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by tcskeptic on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:55AM (#26956746)
Heart rate variability really does not mean variability in heart rate (such as is shown on the graph linked) it is more at the 50-100ms level in change in timing between hear beats. The graph does seem to show a reduction in RHR but does not address HRV (as I understand it)
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by Jtsummers on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:54AM (#26956738)
That image is of GP's heart rate, not heart rate variability.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by mathattack on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @10:41AM (#26956537)
I’ve been largely alcohol free since the new year. Prior to that I thought alcohol helped me rest. Now even one or two glasses of beer or wine messes up my sleep. The contrast helps me understand it better. Of course this anecdote shouldn’t be construed as robust data....
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by intergalplan on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @11:20AM (#26957118)
I've been working on switching most drinking for weed—for health reasons. Seriously. It's the best and lowest-side-effect sleep aid I've used. Hopefully it's not secretly doing horrible things to me, but my sleep quality's been amazing since I started to take a little a couple nights a week. Most consistently-decent sleep of my life.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by JohnWhigham on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:01PM (#26957735)
Weed inhibits REM sleep. You may feel rested, but you're actually harming yourself long term.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by mr-wendel on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:35PM (#26958246)
You're also inhibiting your ability to dream (and your ability to remember them). That is a lot of critical emotional processing not happening. Dreams matter, even if they don't make rational sense.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by intergalplan on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:10PM (#26957868)
Damnit. Well, it's that or lots of 5-6 hour nights, or worse. Or bad hangovers and other weird shit from sleeping pills. Maybe time to get a sleep-tracker watch.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by WindyCityBrew on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @01:10PM (#26958697)
Do you drink a lot of coffee or other caffeinated drinks, especially later in the day? I used to think caffeine didn't have much affect on my sleep, until I cut it out. Old habits die hard, but I just drink decaf coffee now and am getting better sleep then I can remember.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by intergalplan on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @01:51PM (#26959177)
~2 cups of coffee probably 5-6 days a week, sometimes tea instead, rarely past noon and never past ~2:00PM (I only drink it as late as, say, 1:00PM if I happen not to realize how late it is). Maybe one soda per month, tops, don't really pay attention to when I have those, though. I'd guess afternoon/evening mostly, but it's rare enough that I doubt it's doing anything meaningful to my overall sleep-trends.

I could try cutting it out, but I've had trouble falling asleep my entire life, and my average annual caffeine intake was very low until my mid-teens. I'm actually much better about sleep now than I used to be, even without meds. Worth a shot, though, I guess. I'd been thinking about dropping my intake to one cup per day, alternating coffee and green tea (which would represent a large increase in my consumption of green tea) anyway. Hell, at lower volume I could justify buying the expensive, low-package-weight, really, really good beans, so the flavor of the coffee I'm drinking would improve, though I might have to group coffee-days rather than alternate them, to avoid issues with beans going stale. Seems like ~halving my caffeine would be an OK start.

Sigh. Guess I'm going to be spending a lot of money on sparkling water, just like when I kicked my soda habit :-)

Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by criddell on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:35PM (#26958239)
It might be worth going to a specialist for help.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by txsoftwaredev on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @12:24PM (#26958072)
I've had a similar experience. I've been using delta-8 at night for sleep and I've added 1-2 hrs a night according to my fitbit. I don't feel "hungover" or similar like I would from alcohol or OTC sleeping meds.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by mathattack on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @02:11PM (#26959400)
I haven’t replaced it with anything else. At some point I will try to kick caffeine but one vice at a time. :-)
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by fraa-orolo on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:10AM (#26955348)
Since we're talking anecdata anyway, it could be from decreased sleep quality instead of direct causation.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by antibuddy on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:20AM (#26955442)
That might indeed be a factor; however the processes to get rid of the alcohol (it's toxic after all) might be to blame as well.
Re:Surprisingly little alcohol can affect heart rate variabi... by BiteCode_dev on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @09:09AM (#26955339)
n = 1, but using my oura ring, I can see a diff of 10% higher RHR pmb during my sleep when drinking a single glass of beer after diner.

It surprised me a lot.