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Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by alexophile on Friday June 17, 2011 @11:50AM (#2665944)
That false comparison has always bothered me. Preying on the weak for fun instead of profit doesn't make you right, it makes you sound like a sociopath.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by nihilocrat on Friday June 17, 2011 @12:03PM (#2666005)
I think everything else said in the post proves they are sociopaths. They don't seem to place value in "peons", "lulz lizards", or really any kind of human beings.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by dclowd9901 on Friday June 17, 2011 @12:19PM (#2666072)
It's always been posited that, at some point, the Internet would create a generation of pseudo-sociopaths who are so disconnected from fellow human beings, they lack empathy, much the same as someone with the clinical diagnosis.

Mayhap that time has arrived.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by moxiemk1 on Friday June 17, 2011 @12:46PM (#2666181)
Just like with violent video games, the internet doesn't make people feel disconnected, or turn them into sociopaths.

It enables people who would rather be disconnected to disconnect themselves, and gives sociopaths the ability to do far more.

The internet doesn't create people without empathy, it reveals that deep down, a lot of humanity didn't have it to begin with. The way society is starting to structure itself, though, lets that shine through more clearly.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by scythe on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:30PM (#2666547)
>The internet doesn't create people without empathy, it reveals that deep down, a lot of humanity didn't have it to begin with. The way society is starting to structure itself, though, lets that shine through more clearly.

A lot? I doubt LulzSec is more than five people. For every pathological script-kiddie there are ten Free Software hackers. The Internet has revealed new ways for people to be destructive, but it has also revealed more ways that they can be constructive.

Compare:

http://www.quantcast.com/github.com

http://www.quantcast.com/4chan.org

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by Will_Price on Friday June 17, 2011 @05:59PM (#2667247)
Excellent post scythe, I fully agree with you. The comparison of numbers between gthub and 4chan is a nice indicator that there are more than these sociopaths, When you have lulzsec waving their arms in front of the internet it's sometimes easy to forget they're are millions of great people producing software, for others, for the betterment of humanity.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by 9999 on Friday June 17, 2011 @07:44PM (#2667505)
Not everyone on 4chan is a sociopath. Even on /b/, not everyone is a sociopath.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by scythe on Friday June 17, 2011 @08:34PM (#2667597)
Of course not, just like not every project on github is open source. It just seemed like a nice glance at the ways people choose to spend time online.

I doubt society was ever much more virtuous than it is today, but we do hear about the problems more. There is the orthogonal and much more serious issue that many more people today feel unfulfilled in their lives than they did before, but I can't even begin to address that -- read Infinite Jest by David Foster Wallace if that interests or concerns you.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by yters on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:00PM (#2666453)
Just like advertisements don't convince people to buy stuff.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by sradnidge on Friday June 17, 2011 @01:59PM (#2666447)
Well said.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by ericmoritz on Friday June 17, 2011 @05:16PM (#2667113)
It's easy to be a sociopath on the Internet where humanity is lost.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by SaintMax on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:29PM (#2666546)
Having no moral doesn't make you a sociopath.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by kenjackson on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:53PM (#2666629)
That's almost the textbook definition:

a person, as a psychopathic personality, whose behavior is antisocial and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by seats on Friday June 17, 2011 @11:59AM (#2665988)
Preying on the weak for fun

Preying on the weak for profit

They both kind of have a sociopath sound to them

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by SonicSoul on Monday June 20, 2011 @11:02AM (#2674428)
I suppose this is a matter of phrasing.

Do car mechanics pray on weak for profit because not everyone learned how to fix their car? They trust mechanics because they devoted many years of their life at becoming good at what they do. Does that make them sociopaths? logic fail.

You could also say that white hat hackers provide a service of security for the benefit of those that spend their time creating other things.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by bxr on Friday June 17, 2011 @12:16PM (#2666055)
But, only one of them is the foundation of our society.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by burgerbrain on Friday June 17, 2011 @01:32PM (#2666350)
I'm not sure which one you think it is, but I sure hope it's the one that does it for fun.

A society driven by preying on the weak for profit is far more distressing.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by JoshCole on Friday June 17, 2011 @03:46PM (#2666816)
You guys do realize that the bit about preying on the weak for profit is just a bit of rhetoric? It isn't really true.

The person who is weak in this case is a customer. This customer is lacking in skills related to computer security. The person who is preying on the weak is someone who invested time into learning about the skills that the customer does not know. Let's say this customer was a farmer. He is using the money he too got from preying on the weak non-farmers to purchase protection.

In the case of preying on the weak for fun we also have some things being hidden behind the words. For example, fun in this case means stealing identities, trying to ruin relationships, and sending dildos to innocents.

It's cool though for the author because by having things written in these terms its easy for people to talk past each other. They don't realize the context in which he has placed the words in the article. When other people see the terms its easy to think that maybe "preying on the weak for profit" is referring to blackhats instead of capitalism.

Another thing worth pointing out is that the person who is volunteering to give away the information for free is actually someone who also put in a lot of time to learn all the things that the customer didn't know. So when he says "I could teach it to him quickly" he is really saying "I will provide the same service in exchange for you're weekend." The thing is that when these two "companies" compete only the one charging money is going to stay afloat. So the dildo sending altruist who wants fun to be the basis of society goes back to sending dildos while the guy who charged the money actually does the job.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by bethling on Friday June 17, 2011 @01:51PM (#2666420)
As sad as it sounds, I really think it's preying on the weak for profit. So much of society/economy/whatever very much depends on taking advantage of those who are don't have much other choice in the matter.

I don't think it's as visible to us as it used to be, but I think it's still very much there.

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by CWuestefeld on Friday June 17, 2011 @04:11PM (#2666892)
See: "Invisible Hand"

In economics, the invisible hand, also known as invisible hand of the market, is the term economists use to describe the self-regulating nature of the marketplace. This is a metaphor first coined by the economist Adam Smith in The Theory of Moral Sentiments... For Smith, the invisible hand was created by the conjunction of the forces of self-interest, competition, and supply and demand, which he noted as being capable of allocating resources in society.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_hand

Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by yters on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:02PM (#2666456)
You mean the foundation of Taliban and Mafia society. You know, it is quite possible to make money by being good. It just doesn't grab headlines as effectively.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by jarek on Friday June 17, 2011 @02:45PM (#2666606)
And quite trivial to make more money preying on the weak than being good.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by yters on Friday June 17, 2011 @06:42PM (#2667365)
At least in the short term. But, that's definitely not the foundation for any functional society.
Re:LulzSec: Why we do what we do by danielharan on Friday June 17, 2011 @01:17PM (#2666281)
Which one?