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Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by evolve2k on Monday February 22, 2021 @09:43PM (#26233298)
You might (not) be surprised to hear this is a US centric practice. In Australia this behaviour would fall foul of consumer protection laws. Our Consumer protection act and government body has real teeth and these practices would fail the requirement not to engage is misleading and deceptive practices.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by jlglover on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:20PM (#26233514)
It was a real shock when I moved to the U.S. and the posted price on items didn't match with what I actually had to pay. In Australia, the posted price is the price, and must "include any tax, duty, fee, levy or other additional charges"
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by ars on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:00PM (#26233671)
That's mostly because local sales tax makes it very hard to advertise a price - each small locality might have a different tax level, and a different final price.

So if you are trying to send a mailer or run a tv ad, what price do you do?

That's different from fees that don't vary by location, like in this article.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by michaelpb on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:31PM (#26233839)
I mean it's just a tax the business has to pay to the government, calculated based on products sold. Any business could conceivably do something similar with any tax if they wanted, e.g. add a "XYZ fee" that's added at the register to compensate for XYZ tax. (And in fact many businesses in the US do exactly this, listing each tax as an excuse to tack on arbitrary extra hidden fees at check-out!)

I think this also doubles as a political statement. Basically a subtle way to shift "blame" and make consumers feel upset about a tax, and more likely to put pressure on governments to reduce said taxes. Ultimately it's all anti-consumer.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by weberer on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @07:47AM (#26236672)
Its not shifting the blame. Its placing the blame squarely on where it belongs. If you're in New Hampshire and buy something listed as $1, then you only have to pay $1. Why? Because New Hampshire does not charge any sales tax. But if you were to cross the border into Massachusetts, then suddenly everything has an extra 6.25% tacked on at checkout solely because the Massachusetts state government decided to tax each transaction at 6.25%.

>I mean it's just a tax the business has to pay to the government, calculated based on products sold

No, its explicitly a tax on each transaction to be paid by the buyer. You're probably thinking of corporate tax, which the company also has to pay, but is completely separate from sales tax.

From their site:

>The buyer pays the sales tax, as an addition to the purchase price, to the vendor at the time of purchase. The vendor then sends the tax to Massachusetts. For motor vehicle and trailer sales, however, the buyer pays the sales tax directly to Massachusetts.

https://www.mass.gov/guides/sales-and-use-tax

>Ultimately it's all anti-consumer.

Yeah. Fortunately, New Hampshire is a lovely place to live.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by M2Ys4U on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:23PM (#26233802)
I'm not in the US, but I assume that the shop calculates the correct taxes at the till, right?

So what's stopping them putting tax-inclusive prices on shelves or on stickers on the items themselves?

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by jldugger on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:32PM (#26233847)
It's not the stickers on the shelves, though it would be mildly annoying to retag the entire store, it's the ads in the newspaper. Low margin businesses like groceries can't advertise an all-in price for their stores in the metro area when every tiny municipality in a metro has a slightly different tax rate.

Growing up in suburban Kansas City, we had both city, county and state sales taxes which could vary based on a short drive. And then there's certain entities which are allowed tax exemptions, like teachers making qualified purchases for some things.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by sellyme on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:54PM (#26233949)
> Low margin businesses like groceries can't advertise an all-in price for their stores in the metro area when every tiny municipality in a metro has a slightly different tax rate.

Yes they can. Just have a constant price in that advertising region for the premium items you're advertising, eat the cost in locations with high sales tax rates (or rent, or wages, or shipping costs, or any other of the ten thousand other factors that they already deal with without issue), and make up for it in the areas where costs are lower than average.

Almost every single large business in the United States already does this, and it would be incredibly trivial for them to do it for sales tax as well.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by jldugger on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @12:58AM (#26234247)
Pretty sure this is a factor in how we ended up with food deserts: municipalities that couldn't rely on property taxes to cover their budget raised sales taxes, and chains closed their underperformers. Which of course means the municipality loses more tax base as their citizens shop in another city.

Almost every large grocery store business does this, and a brief google street view tour of North St Louis will show multiple places where grocery stores have vanished and been replaced, if at all, by dollar stores.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by jareklupinski on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @12:59AM (#26234251)
now i'm curious; has anyone been to a store that doesn't have a computer at the till / register, and the person ringing up your goods had to calculate the subtotal + sales tax = total by hand?

the few times i remember handing over a specific sum of cash at thrift/vintage stores, indie shops, etc smaller stores here or there, they would always seem to include the tax in the displayed price if there was no computer to calculate the final tax, and the receipt (if any) was whole numbers throughout

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by cafard on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @09:15AM (#26237451)
No, not since I was a teenage employee at McDonalds, and doing the arithmetic with a pencil. The next summer I saw my first computerized cash registers. But then I was a stockboy and had nothing to do with the point of sale. (Summers of 1972 and 1973.)
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by rrauenza on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @11:34AM (#26239272)
I can’t recall where, but I’ve been to small shops in the US where they’ve whipped out a small table to calculate the tax.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by ncallaway on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:21PM (#26233788)
If their POS system can charge you the correct amount at the cash register, it could also print the price label that goes on the shelf.

If this were the law all retail businesses would be able to comply and it wouldn't even be a significant burden.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by davchana on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:09PM (#26233728)
Not to criticize anything, but India too have similar structure like US, Federal Tax is Central Tax, State Tax is State Tax, City tax is known as Octrai Tax. Even then, anything & everything has MRP sticker or print, Maximum Retail Price, which includes everything. Shops at places with lower tax sells at lower rate, or not, but everything which gets uts price advertised is advertised at MRP.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by exporectomy on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:31PM (#26233846)
Maybe for TV advertising but definitely not the reason for price labels on shelves to omit tax. Retail chains are perfectly capable of printing custom price labels for each branch. Supermarkets in my country have individual pricing per branch.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by kevin_thibedeau on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:09PM (#26233727)
I worked in a grocery store in a state that taxes food. Sometimes bottlers would have a giveaways with prizes revealed under the cap. A free soda being the most common. These were redeemed as a 100% off coupon but we still had to collect a penny in tax.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by xx789 on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:27PM (#26233818)
Its quite amazing to leave North America, go to a restaurant, order a meal that's $10 on the menu and pay $10. Incredible.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by arwhatever on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @09:33AM (#26237683)
U.S. citizen, but have lived and traveled abroad extensively.

Each time I return, the barely letter-of-the-law scams that permeate our economy and culture are a huge aggravation and disappointment.

I know a lot of other people who also do extensive, long-term travel and who express similar sentiments: "The whole society is organized around financially draining you" etc.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by leephillips on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:51PM (#26233625)
I'm not really surprised. In the US we've been trained to expect that what we will wind up paying will be higher than the posted or advertised price.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by rootusrootus on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:06PM (#26233707)
Not everywhere. I pay the posted price, not a penny more.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by leephillips on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:11PM (#26233737)
Do you live in a state without state sales tax?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by rootusrootus on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @12:58PM (#26240426)
I do indeed. I understand the frustration with going to the checkout and having to pay more than you expect, because I feel that whiplash every time I go somewhere with a sales tax. I'm used to the bill being exactly what it said when I picked up <whatever thing> off the shelf.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by selestify on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:14PM (#26233755)
You mean without sales tax?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by leephillips on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:15PM (#26233759)
Yes, sorry. Fixed with an edit.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by lawl on Tuesday February 23, 2021 @01:37AM (#26234437)
> You might (not) be surprised to hear this is a US centric practice. In Australia this behaviour would fall foul of consumer protection laws.

And i'm pretty sure every single country in europe, and from my limited experience in asia, probably in most countries there too.

Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by shadowmore on Monday February 22, 2021 @09:58PM (#26233395)
This just reminds me of how we ship meat from the US to China for processing and then back, then slap "US Raised" on it to avoid suspicion.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by xx789 on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:01PM (#26233677)
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by buzzerbetrayed on Monday February 22, 2021 @09:59PM (#26233398)
Mind explaining more to someone who has never heard of this?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by WrtCdEvrydy on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:09PM (#26233452)
It's pretty common to ship chicken to china for processing since the cost of shipping is lower than labor... however since it was raised in the US, it's totally legal to say "US Raised Chickens"
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by Retric on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:30PM (#26233837)
It’s actually extremely rare. As of 2018 there where 4 Chinese processing plants that took chickens killed and frozen in the US, thawed them out for processing, and then froze them again and shipped them back to the US. Bulk freight shipping is generally cheap, but shipping frozen goods across the Pacific Ocean twice adds up.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by steve_adams_86 on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:11PM (#26233464)
This just screams race to the bottom to me. There is absolutely no accounting for externalities. I need to look into whether or not Canada does this.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by WrtCdEvrydy on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:21PM (#26233516)
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by rootusrootus on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:10PM (#26233730)
Did you read the article? They are exporting chicken to China to be consumed there, not processed and shipped back.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by mofosyne on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:39PM (#26233578)
Might be cheap in monitary terms but... not sure it's as energy efficient. What's the environmental impact?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by klipt on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:42PM (#26233589)
Ocean freight is extremely energy efficient isn't it? Much cheaper than overland trucking for the same distance and weight?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by DamnYuppie on Monday February 22, 2021 @10:54PM (#26233642)
This argument falls apart once you realize that the meat is taken to and from the ships via trucks and rail.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by jojobas on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:21PM (#26233785)
Money is energy. You hire an American and he consumes twice as much energy, and produces twice as much emissions, compared to a Chinese.
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by bpodgursky on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:02PM (#26233682)
Given how many US slaughterhouses there are, I'm a little skeptical this is common practice. Could you find some #s?
Re:Experiment shows why ticket sellers hit you with last-sec... by rootusrootus on Monday February 22, 2021 @11:11PM (#26233739)
It's an urban legend.