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Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by inetknght on Friday January 22, 2021 @03:35PM (#25876036)
> Scroolbars are useful for making large coarse leaps within a page in an instant, while scroll wheels are good for accurate positioning over short distances.

That's funny. I use them in the exact opposite way.

When I want exact positioning then I will use the scrollbar. When I want to scroll past pages and pages, I will just fling the scrollwheel.

Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by derefr on Friday January 22, 2021 @07:08PM (#25878066)
Sounds like you aren't scrolling in large-enough documents. Scrollbars are pretty useless for exact positioning in a 5000-page PDF; and scrollwheels won't get you very far, either, unless you're willing to scroll for literal minutes.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by inetknght on Friday January 22, 2021 @07:20PM (#25878153)
In those documents I use control-f and search for what I want instead.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by gsich on Friday January 22, 2021 @08:30PM (#25878636)
If you know what you want - yes.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by tomc1985 on Saturday January 23, 2021 @02:23AM (#25880387)
Read the Table of Contents and Jump to Page
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by derefr on Saturday January 23, 2021 @10:37AM (#25882957)
Often what I’m looking for in a document is a particular image or diagram I remember seeing, embedded somewhere in e.g. a long journal paper or textbook. I know enough to know what section of the paper or book it’s in, but I haven’t a clue what exactly it was labelled, let alone what the specific context was. But I can picture the diagram, so I’ll know it when I see it again, whizzing by. I just don’t need to whiz by the entire document, because I can be sure I saw it “in the middle” or “near the end.”
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by saagarjha on Friday January 22, 2021 @11:36PM (#25879694)
Have you tried momentum scrolling?
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by derefr on Saturday January 23, 2021 @10:32AM (#25882897)
Momentum scrolling has a capped velocity†. Your velocity with momentum scrolling approximates a sigmoid. And the cap is far too low to actually get somewhere, if where you want to be is “somewhere in the last few chapters of a book” and you’re currently at the beginning.

Scroll bars, on the other hand are perfect for that kind of jump — where you don’t know what you’re looking for, but you know mostly where it is, and you’ll recognize it when you see it.

† There was a time, right when momentum scrolling was first introduced as a third-party mouse-driver feature ca. Windows 98, where it wasn’t capped. But that was a horrible UX: if something was really far down the document, then by the time you saw the thing you wanted to stop at, you would often be going far too fast and overshoot it by a lot, requiring almost as much scrolling back in the other direction. This first iteration of the feature basically expected people to understand how to “land” on a target using inertial, frictionless thrust. I imagine there were some future Kerbal Space Program players who enjoyed that, but most people didn’t.

Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by saagarjha on Sunday January 24, 2021 @05:21AM (#25890857)
Hmm, I'm not sure. On macOS at least if it is capped it's capped at something very high because I don't think I've ever had an issue getting through something long.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by crysin on Friday January 22, 2021 @04:45PM (#25876694)
I think it's dependent on your mouse too. Personally I only use mice that have a click wheel, I absolutely hate free-spinning scroll wheels.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by wolrah on Friday January 22, 2021 @05:30PM (#25877117)
IMO the best mice ever are the Logitech MX Revolution and MX Master series that have an electronic clutch on the wheel. It's clicky by default but if you whip it the clutch unlocks and you can traverse an entire EULA in 0.6 seconds.

Some of their newer gaming mice have a half-ass version of this as well with a manual mechanical toggle.

Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by p1mrx on Friday January 22, 2021 @06:02PM (#25877398)
The MX Master 3 takes this further by using an electropermanent magnet, which is technology I didn't know existed:

https://blog.bolt.io/logitech-mx-master-3-vs-2s/

Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by bonestamp2 on Friday January 22, 2021 @07:14PM (#25878119)
I have this mouse and didn't realize that's how it worked. I bet that technology could by applied to laptop keyboards to give them extra travel when the lid is open and tuck them down when the lid is closed.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by inetknght on Friday January 22, 2021 @07:23PM (#25878173)
I have one and I like it. It's not the best for gaming if you like lots of buttons but otherwise it's great.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by BoorishBears on Saturday January 23, 2021 @12:12AM (#25879864)
That explains the explosion of scroll wheel complaints with the 3 over the 1 and 2.
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by smichel17 on Friday January 22, 2021 @10:55PM (#25879476)
I see your 0.6seconds and raise 0.2 seconds for my <End> key ;)
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by dredmorbius on Friday January 29, 2021 @02:14PM (#25961103)
Is the EULA scroll the new Kessel Run?
Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by germ on Friday January 22, 2021 @05:49PM (#25877275)
I use a Elecom Huge with drag-scrolling enabled (check xinput if you're curious!). For any kind of scrolling I just hold a sidebutton down and roll the ball, it's very handy and feels better then using a wheel, even if imprecise.

For exact scrolling I'll use the scroll wheel or dive for the scrollbar.

What I really want is a toggle bound to a button for enabling/disabling drag scrolling. Most of my flow is keyboard based so being able to toggle that on/off for a dedicated stroller would be great.

Re:Remembering Windows 3.1 themes and user empowerment by inetknght on Friday January 22, 2021 @07:22PM (#25878169)
I usually agree. However I got a Logitech MX Master 3. It has a magnetic scrollwheel instead of a mechanical one. That also enables it to have a little button to switch between clicky scrollwheel and free-spinning scrollwheel. Super handy!

Its battery lasts about a few weeks with above-average use (12+ hours per day, 7 days per week)