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Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by influx on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:38PM (#25720919)
How far should this go? Should banks refuse to service employees? Grocery stores? Gas stations? They are private businesses, they have no reason to tolerate people who are thinking the wrong way.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by simonh on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:49PM (#25721087)
In general I think we all should be free to associate or do business with whoever we choose. That should be the default position. There may have to be some exceptions where available options are limited for crucial services. I’m trying to avoid using the word Monopoly because it’s bandied about so much inappropriately, but some services are so essential and providers are so limited that we should probably expect them to be provided to anyone making a legal request for access.

Those are specific circumstances though and I don’t think any of these - law firms, internet hosting, etc reach that threshold.

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by DenisM on Sunday January 10, 2021 @09:08PM (#25723394)
Legal counsel is not essential?
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by kthejoker2 on Sunday January 10, 2021 @11:24PM (#25724495)
Legal counsel != a specific law firm.

AWS is one service. YouTube is one service. Twitter is one service.

Yes, they are big services - in most cases, the biggest service among their competitors.

They have stakeholders and financial incentives to not be associated with - or worse, seen as condoning - deeply unpopular or controversial political positions.

Why is it so easy to understand when it's a baker refusing to bake a cake for a homosexual wedding or a Christian-owned company refusing to provide birth control for their employees?

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by geofft on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:53PM (#25721141)
There's two questions which we should distinguish:

1. Should there be a bright-line rule - either enforced by government or strong social pressure - about whether people must engage in business with other people, and on what grounds they may discriminate?

2. Should there be a social norm that businesses should try to serve all customers where possible, for the good of customers?

Our society generally answers 1 with that you must refrain from discriminating on the grounds of deep personal characteristics and no otherwise. You cannot throw someone out of your bar for being black. You can throw them out for being drunk and picking fights. You cannot refuse to hire an employee who needs to take a few breaks a day to pray. You can refuse to hire an employee who needs to take a few breaks a day to hire Fiverrs to do their job for them. You cannot refuse to offer credit cards to ethnic North Koreans living in America. You can (and must!) refuse to offer credit cards to North Korean citizens.

This is a sensible position, because it balances the general right to freedom of association / the government not micromanaging your business transactions with the more specific individual rights to participate in society. I cannot change my race, and (we have decided) it's unreasonable to expect me to change my religion. I can (we have decided) change my competence, and I can certainly change whether I start bar fights.

We could decide otherwise, but I think the existing position has a lot of merit.

Number 2 is a more interesting question, but I think the norm of our society is that it should be answered by the free market. We expect that businesses want to serve as many customers as possible anyway because it's the most profitable. Should they decide that they don't want to serve certain customers, it's generally not the place of either the government or strong social norms to say, we wish to override your decision-making process and tell you what to do (apart from the bright-line rule in question 1). Part of the freedom of a free market is that actors are free to decide what to do on their own, including to make mistakes, and no central planning committee tells them what is best for society. We expect this approach will lead to fewer mistakes and a better society.

Again, I think this position has a lot of merit, and we should figure out why we want to change it.

[dead]
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by j8hn on Sunday January 10, 2021 @06:25PM (#25721531)
Who decides who are the fascists?

A community activist in Seattle is organizing against Antifa calling them terrorists for causing violence and hijacking social justice issues such as Black Lives Matter and the homeless issue.

Should that group also be refused by everyone, or does it depend on political ideology?

Source:

https://twitter.com/choeshow/status/1345184414016278528

https://twitter.com/choeshow/status/1345192831602679809

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by trianglem on Sunday January 10, 2021 @08:44PM (#25723157)
Common sense and arbitrary decisions. If you’re making this point you’re a bad faith actor.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by j8hn on Sunday January 10, 2021 @08:56PM (#25723284)
Can you explain how I'm a bad faith actor.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by trianglem on Monday January 11, 2021 @02:41AM (#25725904)
Because the literal definition of fascism is far-right and authoritarian.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by j8hn on Monday January 11, 2021 @03:37AM (#25726271)
Here are some definitions of fascism:

"forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism"

"violent suppression of the opposition"

The business owner in the video has said the Antifa group has retaliated against his business by smashing their windows and causing destruction to other business for sending a letter to the Mayor.

Victoria Beach from the African-American community relations says in the video "if you don't agree with them they're going to attack you in some way, in a group, not one on one. They are cowards and we aren't going to take it".

According to the literal definition they are fascists.

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by trianglem on Monday January 11, 2021 @12:01PM (#25731795)
No, being a fascist by definition requires you to be on the right of the political spectrum. Where did you get those definitions from? Parler?
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by mcphage on Sunday January 10, 2021 @07:29PM (#25722323)
> Who decides who are the fascists?

Well, let’s start with: the ones who took over the US Capitol building. And then later we can look at the results, decide if that was enough or not, and act accordingly.

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by j8hn on Sunday January 10, 2021 @09:02PM (#25723334)
That's a strange framework to decide who the fascists are.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by mcphage on Sunday January 10, 2021 @09:26PM (#25723555)
That’s what’s great about it—you don’t need a framework at all. You can look at your surroundings and decide what is most appropriate right now.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by j8hn on Sunday January 10, 2021 @09:39PM (#25723663)
So when Veronica Beach talks about Antifa terrorizing parts of Seattle, are they fascists?
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by mcphage on Monday January 11, 2021 @07:14AM (#25727891)
If they haven’t tried taking over the government yet, I’d say, wait.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by trianglem on Monday January 11, 2021 @12:21PM (#25732184)
No, fascists are by definition right wing.
Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by oldgradstudent on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:42PM (#25720975)
In what sense are big banks private businesses?

Banks, especially the big ones, will always be bailed out in a crisis. We've just had a demonstration about a decade ago.

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by simonh on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:56PM (#25721172)
Everyone gets bailouts at some level, hence welfare, stimulus cheques, Medicare and Medicaid in the US. More so over here (Brit).

Financial services get very heavily regulated which imposes huge costs, so it is arguable that imposes a certain level of obligation on government. I think that’s a reasonable case, though I’m not entirely happy with the way it’s been handled in practice. It’s not a perfect world.

Re:Parler CEO Says Service Dropped by “Every Vendor” and Cou... by throwaway189262 on Sunday January 10, 2021 @05:50PM (#25721104)
I don't think the average person is at risk of starting riots with white supremacists. Parler should be treated the same way as Al Queda. Totally radioactive