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Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by geocrasher on Thursday December 24, 2020 @09:01PM (#25533527)
It is interesting that so much of history isn't what we think it is. For example, who broke the sound barrier first? Of course, it was Chuck Yeager in Glamorous Glennis, the rocket powered Bell X-1 named after his wife. Or was it?

The book "Aces Wild" [1] says that it was unofficially broken before that in an XP-86 (The experimental F-86, a jet powered fighter) in a dive, and witnesses on the ground heard sonic booms before Yeager's flight that day. But history favors the hero's, and in this case, the science: We know 100% for sure, because of science, that Yeager officially broke the sound barrier first.

It is quite possible that the F-86 test pilots who stuck their planes in a dive likely did it first. It is well documented that the F-86 was capable of Mach 1 in a dive. Even so, that's not what the history books say, so that's not what we teach kids in school. I suspect it'll always be the same with the F14 computer vs the Intel 4004.

[1] https://www.airspacemag.com/history-of-flight/mach-1-whoduni...

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by breput on Thursday December 24, 2020 @09:25PM (#25533645)
There were many cases of pilots breaking the sound barrier in a dive prior to the X-1, even during World War II, and even some of them living to tell the tale. That was never in dispute.

The point of the X-1 has always been that it was the first human piloted plane that broke the sound barrier in level, controlled, and repeatable flight.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by na85 on Thursday December 24, 2020 @10:31PM (#25533944)
>There were many cases of pilots breaking the sound barrier in a dive prior to the X-1, even during World War II,

Aerospace engineer and amateur WWII historian here: I'm not aware of any credible claims from that era. The only WWII-era claims to have broken the sound barrier (by piloted craft) I've seen can be attributed to poor pitot tube design which gives erroneously high indicated airspeed readings when the ram pressure gets high enough.

A reconnaissance Spitfire I believe is what got closest, at something like .9 of Mach measured by a fancy pitot system at the RAF test establishment.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by marcodiego on Friday December 25, 2020 @12:13AM (#25534373)
Aerospace engineer and amateur historian... nice! Would you enlighten us about the main problems with Hans Guido Mutke claims?
Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by na85 on Friday December 25, 2020 @01:03AM (#25534611)
It basically boils down to the fact that machmeters hadn't been invented yet, because the physics of supersonic flight wasn't sufficiently understood back then.

Shock waves develop inside the pitot tube under certain conditions, and that causes a spike (or sometimes a drop) in pressure which is interpreted by the instrument as a corresponding rise or drop in airspeed.

Edit: as for the 262 claim itself it was pretty handily debunked in a post-war NACA technical note. If you dig around on the NTRS you can find it.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by geocrasher on Friday December 25, 2020 @12:29AM (#25534434)
From Wikipedia: " Compressibility in pitot tubes of the time often resulted in exaggerated speed readings near the speed of sound, particularly in German equipment, which was adversely affected by supply shortages as the war progressed"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Guido_Mutke

In other words, it's the same problem that the piston-engined aircraft of the time had: Anomalous readings at high speed.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by redis_mlc on Thursday December 24, 2020 @10:53PM (#25534041)
As usual, the Germans were first, with the V-2 reaching Mach 5 in the 1940's, which was to an extent controllable (they landed in England.)

For an airplane to reach Mach 1, this mainly requires thin wings and enough power/dive. To control it, you need a flying tail, and swept wings and "waisting" the fuselage reduces the amount of power needed.

So almost all of the planes in WW2 were "too thick" and incapable of supersonic flight, though could have exceeded Mach 1 with modified wings, tail and in a dive.

The US P-80 (1945) and F-86 (1949) jets had underpowered engines, in the sense that all early jet engines had limited power.

However the F-86 had swept wings, and later versions of the F-86 had a flying tail, so if you pointed it at the ground, you could get a sonic boom without losing control.

Source: I study aerodynamics.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by navinojha on Friday December 25, 2020 @02:34AM (#25534931)
tuyiy
Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by saltyshake on Thursday December 24, 2020 @11:26PM (#25534184)
Or running speed records. I heard many stories from veterans that during ranher training they did numbers better than the official Olympic records.
Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by gameswithgo on Thursday December 24, 2020 @11:39PM (#25534239)
rangers aren’t above being delusional
Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by hapless on Friday December 25, 2020 @02:39AM (#25534952)
The X-1 could break the sound barrier in level flight. That is to say, it could move across geography, in a measurable way, faster than the speed of sound.

Creating a sonic boom in a deep and dangerous dive is an interesting quirk in a fighter, but it doesn’t set new speed records that would interest the general population.

Re:The First Microprocessor, the F-14, and Me by msla on Wednesday December 30, 2020 @04:42PM (#25586510)
> Or was it?

Yes, it was. Betteridge's Law strikes again.