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Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by simonh on Thursday December 10, 2020 @06:14AM (#25372440)
Most capital is invested in businesses, it's not piles of money in banks, but it's embodied in factories, jobs, products, research efforts. The vast majority fo the wealth of billionaires is tied up in the businesses they control, and that's fine. That money is doing useful work. We don't want to take it away from people who have proven they are effective leaders and managers and hand it over to bureaucrats. Let the people who built the businesses and created the wealth manage it. Tax them yes, that's fine, but at a proportionate level.

The feedback loop in Capitalism is to direct capital towards people who discover more efficient way to provide goods and services, or provide better goods and services, to help them scale up, or give people with a proven track record more resources to devote to new enterprises. This is exactly what we want.

There are three main issues with this picture.

The first is rent seeking behaviour, where simply having capital enables growing more capital without productive activity. This is what we need to tax punitively. Capital that is not being used productively is dead weight on the economy.

Secondly, monopolistic behaviour is closely related to rent seeking, it's using market power to extract rents or exert unfair influence.

Finally inheritance is a problem because it's un-earned wealth. There's no reason to expect that those inheriting wealth are likely to manage it effectively. Inheritance taxes should be high, without being overly punitive after all one of the main incentives to work hard and accumulate wealth is to provide for the next generation. You want to allow successful business owners and investors to benefit their families without facilitating excess waste of resources.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by Barrin92 on Thursday December 10, 2020 @06:26AM (#25372504)
>We don't want to take it away from people who have proven they are effective leaders and managers and hand it over to bureaucrats.

This sentence is so bizarre not even the opposite is correct. First off, 'effective leaders and managers' isn't an antonym to 'bureaucrat'. There are effective leaders and managers in bureaucracies. In fact that's kind of what bureaucracy means, effective and rational management of resources.

Furthermore, bureaucracies exist both in the private sector and public sector. Wealthy billionaires employ hundreds (if not more) of individuals doing nothing but managing their wealth in highly bureaucratic fashion. They don't run around and employ their billions in some sort of crazy act of pizza and dorm-room fuelled creative destruction, the deploy countless of institutions and non-profits and accountants and lawyers, the gates foundation looks more like the tax office or a defense department than a garage workshop.

>, or give people with a proven track record more resources to devote to new enterprises

No, the point of capitalism is to allocate capital to people who don't have any proven track record. Because that's the people who actually make new things. If you only want to distribute money to people with track records then a bureaucracy is the right address, because correctly licensing, testing, rewarding, and promoting people based on their track record is the very essence of the ideal Weberian bureaucracy. Keeping track of who does a good job is 90% of what bureaucracies are all about.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by simonh on Thursday December 10, 2020 @06:33AM (#25372543)
OK, that's fair to a point, I'm just saying taking away wealth from the people that built it in the first place and putting it under the control of people who have not demonstrated those skills (whatever skills they do have) isn't necessarily a good idea.

As long as the capital is being employed productively and managed by the most competent people to do so, we all benefit. I'm carefully trying to avoid a 'tax bad, government bad' position and the phrasing you pointed out quite reasonably might have given that impression.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by mmc4444 on Thursday December 10, 2020 @06:43AM (#25372610)
> inheritance is a problem because it's un-earned wealth

> Inheritance taxes should be high, without being overly punitive

What's strange is that when you talk to people about inheritance tax they become instantly outraged at the idea of the government taking their money by force, yet they seem to have no problem with the government forcibly taking close to half of their salary.

It's a strange paradox and it seems that people just aren't used to the idea, despite it being much fairer. Tax the wealth of the dead rather than the earnings of the living.

If we could slash income tax in half but implement an inheritance tax of, for example, 50% above a certain threshold, it would be a win-win for everyone. The rich would still leave lots of money to their kids and the average person would get to keep more of their earned money. It's more meritocratic on every level.

Sadly, so many of our leaders now are very wealthy themselves, so this isn't a proposition they're likely to be enthusiastic about.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by jandrese on Thursday December 10, 2020 @01:43PM (#25376880)
The problem with inheritance taxes is that corporations don't have to pass their assets onto their children in order to continue existing. They're a half measure.

That said this is an issue that for some reason has a lot of poor people who would never be affected taking up the torch in support of the very same billionaires that are currently screwing them over. It's really remarkable the power of propaganda.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by simonh on Thursday December 10, 2020 @03:42PM (#25378340)
Corporations don’t own themselves though, people do. Effective ownership and control are the main goals that benefit society, as long as the organisation is well run and generating useful goods and services, and employing people, we all benefit. Inheritance is an obstacle to that because it’s effectively random in terms of the competence of the inheritors, but there’s nothing random about the leadership of companies. By and large it’s based on merit. If it isn’t, then sure, corporate governance is a legitimate area for policy making.
Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by jandrese on Thursday December 10, 2020 @06:10PM (#25380054)
I think you might be overestimating how much merit is a factor in the selection of board members. Corporate boards are incredibly incestuous. The most reliable way to get on a board is to be in an old money family and know other people on the board.

One could argue that the current system of selecting corporate executives produces no better result than the general election process used to select some government officials. Certainly there is no lack of poorly run companies in the modern world, especially when compared to highly competitive companies like Apple under Steve Jobs and Tesla/SpaceX under Elon Musk. The advantage to corporate boards is that candidates don't have to spend time and energy with public campaigning, but they gravitate towards conservative governance that is unable to adapt to changing times.

At any rate, the competence of the leadership at companies doesn't really matter. If they make money they can be taxed on that. How competent the leadership is may or may not impact how much money they make. Poorly managed companies may even make more money in the short term.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by simonh on Friday December 11, 2020 @03:17AM (#25383558)
Well, badly run companies die and get eaten by their competitors. That’s fine. We do of course need to make sure markets are competitive and that incumbents aren’t unfairly privileged, so there is a role for regulation, but the basic competitive system is fine.
Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by jelliclesfarm on Saturday December 12, 2020 @01:44AM (#25396212)
Inherited wealth is already taxed at source. Taxing it again is double taxation. What is being levied is basically a death tax. You are taxed because you died.

Your statement is a gross misunderstanding of tax codes. Inheritance should not only be protected from excessive taxation, it shouldn’t be taxed at all in the first place. It is literally taxing Death.

Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by stolsvik on Saturday December 12, 2020 @04:51AM (#25397111)
Why is “taxing Death” a problem?
Re:Hyundai to acquire Boston Dynamics by jelliclesfarm on Saturday December 12, 2020 @01:38PM (#25400387)
A death tax says that the govt would gain/profit from someone dying. Family is the only way to remain immortal and inheritance is transferring assets to extensions of one’s own DNA. Because DNA..it can be argued is ‘property’.

The state can levy a small fee to retire identity of the deceased for legal purposes. But other than that, transfer of wealth being taxed is theft.