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Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by jhoechtl on Saturday October 31, 2020 @05:01PM (#24955165)
> Other blockchains are vastly expanding scalability, as well as eliminating the energy usage.

The energy usage combined with proof of work is the backing. If you break that for Bitcoin als is left is trust. The energy used and consumed is like the USD tied to gold (which it is no longer since quite some time)

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by Retric on Saturday October 31, 2020 @05:08PM (#24955207)
You can do proof of work based on random memory access for example rather than pure computation. The monetary cost ends up being identical, but it’s much better for the environment.
Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by gruez on Saturday October 31, 2020 @10:36PM (#24956822)
>but it’s much better for the environment.

Why? If OPEX is reduced (lower electricity costs), it's logical to assume that it will be replaced with CAPEX, given how competitive mining operations are. If that's the case, that will mean electricity being used to power ASICs being replaced with chemicals required to fab semiconductors (along with electricity for those fabs). It might be better in terms of GHG emissions, it would be a wash for overall environmental impact.

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by Retric on Sunday November 01, 2020 @06:37AM (#24958799)
Thinking about environmental issues abstractly aka energy vs chemicals doesn’t give you a basis for comparison. You need to dig into the details. In a green world you’re comparing X square feet of solar panels + Batteries with building RAM and environmentally building more RAM is less damaging.
Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by TheDong on Saturday October 31, 2020 @06:33PM (#24955753)
I haven't heard of this sort of proof of work before. Do you have a reference to it?

If you're referring to memory-hard hashing algorithms, I believe those are just resilient to ASICs/GPUs, but still require significant CPU energy. I'm not convinced those would be better for the environment, so if you're referring to those, do you also have an explanation for why they'd draw relatively less power?

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by Retric on Saturday October 31, 2020 @07:12PM (#24955995)
Memory-hard hashing algorithms are basically the same idea.

They use less power simply because people are going to spend the same total amount of money in terms of compute hardware + energy, however RAM consumes less energy per per dollar spent on it than ASICs/CPU’s etc.

3W per 8GB of DDR4 is a reasonable baseline. https://www.crucial.com/support/articles-faq-memory/how-much...

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by DennisP on Saturday October 31, 2020 @10:22PM (#24956788)
The effort going into proof of work is the effect of Bitcoin's value, not the cause. Due to the difficulty adjustment, the total mining expense adjusts to be a little less than the real value of the reward offered.
Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by nyhc99 on Saturday October 31, 2020 @07:48PM (#24956213)
It is hoped among Ethereum enthusiasts that moving from Proof of Work to Proof of Stake in Ethereum 2.0 will solve those massive energy usage problems without introducing vulnerabilities into the system.
Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by gruez on Saturday October 31, 2020 @10:39PM (#24956836)
>without introducing vulnerabilities into the system.

Did they end up solving the "nothing at stake" problem?

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by PretzelPirate on Sunday November 01, 2020 @08:33AM (#24959391)
Yes. With Ethereum’s PoS system, you get penalized for voting in multiple forks.

See https://eth.wiki/en/concepts/proof-of-stake-faqs (I can’t link to the paragraph).

Re:What Bitcoin’s White Paper Got Right, Wrong and What We S... by gruez on Sunday November 01, 2020 @12:04PM (#24960811)
The "What is the “nothing at stake” problem and how can it be fixed?" proposes 2 solutions. Which one does ethereum use? The page itself is pretty long, and I can't find an answer with a quick skim.