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Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by dmix on Thursday August 27, 2020 @03:43PM (#24297775)
Did the book explore every home getting a vanadium redox or lithium battery? It seems like something that will be needed in the future (further adding to the decentralization). This of course will be expensive and I'm not sure how well tall condo buildings will handle the costs.

It could potentially increase the cost of buying a home in the future. Or significant investment from the government so we don't regress our back to having blackouts (especially when it puts even more pressure on the poor in the name of the environment)... either to homes or some centralized system.

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by Gibbon1 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @04:33PM (#24298317)
Interesting rabbit hole. I bought an Engel dual 120V/12V powered fridge. Runs off 120VAC and 12-24VDC. You can plug it into both and it switches automatically to 12VDC if the 120VAC drops out.

Things I've noticed. Even high efficiency residential fridges aren't that efficient. Some off grid ones use three times less power. And lot of the modern fridges have inverters to drive the compressor. Which means would not that big a stretch to add a 12/24V input like my portable fridge.

I mention this because not all household loads are the same. You really don't want your fridge to stop working. You probably can manage if you can't run you whole house air conditioner full tilt.

Having appliances that can run off back up and ones that can adjust their load probably would help.

Another random opinion is a lot of house wiring could be replaced with Power of Ethernet. There is a new automotive standard that provides up to 100W. A house where lights and light loads were run off POE could be trivially backed up by a battery.

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by sandworm101 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @04:46PM (#24298450)
POE is limited to 30w. That is enough for a few LED bulbs, and by few I mean like two or three.
Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by Dylan16807 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @05:38PM (#24298993)
The claim is really easy to look up. 802.3bt adds 60 and 100 watt modes.

And one ethernet cable per two bulbs would work fine for lots of lighting situations anyway.

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by Gibbon1 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @05:27PM (#24298889)
You are wrong, IEEE 802.3bt type 4 is good for 100W.
Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by sandworm101 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @05:42PM (#24299016)
Ok, old POE standard in my head, but 100W is still only a handful of fixtures on a circuit.
Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by FooHentai on Thursday August 27, 2020 @06:15PM (#24299283)
Not an issue with PoE since you're running a cable out to each device rather than linking them in a loop/circuit.

But then that highlights the problem with trying to PoE and entire house - You have to run a line out from a PoE source to each item you want to deliver power to, and provide a port for each which comes at some cost. I guess you could try and run some kind of PoE passthrough circuit arrangement like you see with some office voip phones...

Complicated.

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by Gibbon1 on Thursday August 27, 2020 @09:39PM (#24300570)
Modern fluorescent and LED lamps are around 10-15 Watts. So you could run 4-6 of them on a circuit.

The other thing is price out Ethernet cable by the foot and compare with 14g Romex. The former is $0.05/ft vs $0.20/ft. And you don't need a licensed electrician to run it.

Also PEO is low voltage and power limited, so safer.

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by core-questions on Thursday August 27, 2020 @08:13PM (#24300133)
That's ten 10W LEDs which is enough for most moderately sized rooms, and you can just run another cable if need be.

I gotta imagine 100W PoE requires some bigger cables than plain-jane Cat5E or even Cat6, though...?

Re:Wind and solar are cheaper than thought, admits UK govern... by Dylan16807 on Friday August 28, 2020 @06:11PM (#24310749)
The main design goal is to use normal cables. It's half an amp per wire max, which works out fine.

The higher power levels require that you take into account how each cable is going to safely dissipate a couple watts, which is easy if you're not running big bundles.