News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by iSoron on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:16PM (#23579383)
> "That’s not what we want on the store" -- Apple Vice President of Worldwide Marketing

What if I own an iPhone and HEY is what I want on my phone? How can I override Apple's decision? If I can't, who really owns this device?

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by cortesoft on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:36PM (#23579558)
Apple crafts their sales pitch around being a secure device that has a lot of restrictions (which means you can't install what you want, but it also protects non-tech savvy people from messing up their device or being hacked)

It is a pretty well established model. I don't like it sometimes either, but you know what you are getting when you buy an iPhone. It isn't like they changed policy after you bought the device.

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by scubbo on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:17PM (#23579394)
> How can I override Apple's decision? If I can't, who really owns this device?

I know you're not, but - anyone earnestly asking this question hasn't been paying attention to Apple since, well, ever.

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by iwasakabukiman on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:27PM (#23579469)
Not just Apple, the entire electronics industry.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by catalogia on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:41PM (#23579597)
TVs used to come with circuit diagrams so that people could repair it themselves at home using standard parts. I've not seen anything like that in many years, even for far simpler appliances.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by moooo99 on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:53PM (#23579682)
> TVs used to come with circuit diagrams so that people could repair it themselves at home using standard parts.

Nowadays a brand new high end +2000€ Samsung TV comes with ads (!) in the menu and the apps feel like they'd be running on a potato. With that kind of Smart TVs, the hardware won't be the issue since it'll be the software that will be obsole way before the hardware. Smart TV is not a promise, its a thread.

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by VegetableUmpire on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:57PM (#23579707)
My new Philips Android TV came with a circuit diagram. It was basically just a punch of arrows pointing to a box labeled 'SoC'.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by scubbo on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:44PM (#23579623)
I feel like that's a disingenuous comparison, given how complex the electronics of appliances must be nowadays (disclaimer: I have absolutely no idea, my experience is strictly at the software level) - but the general principle should still apply to be able to use products that you own in a (non-harmful) way that you choose.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by catalogia on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:50PM (#23579656)
Loads of appliances are still straight forward, simpler than TVs ever were. Vacuum cleaners are not exactly supercomputers.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by alerighi on Friday June 19, 2020 @08:31PM (#23580390)
Still there are components were a schematic would be useful. For example a schematic of the power supply, since 90% of the faults that TVs have are related to that. A power supply is not that complex and having a schematic would mean that repairs would be simpler.

Also nowadays it would be useful to have some sort of debug port, for example a serial port to connect and have a CLI to do diagnostic, upload a new firmware, etc. They have these interfaces in the TVs but most of the time are either disabled or protected so the end user cannot use them.

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by o-__-o on Friday June 19, 2020 @10:05PM (#23580906)
That would mean you could fix it yourself and cut out their authorized repair program. Better to just not put release the schematics, but also not go after anyone that creates the schematics either.

See dishwashers, microwaves, Apple iPhones, and washing machines. Car manufacturers still publish schematics for their circuitry (for a fee)

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by cientifico on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:19PM (#23579417)
If you ask this questions, you shouldn't have an iPhone on the first place.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by newbie578 on Friday June 19, 2020 @08:00PM (#23580190)
If you can state such a statement and not understand his statement, you shouldn't comment in the first place :)
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by newbie578 on Friday June 19, 2020 @08:03PM (#23580217)
Well pointed out, although critics will say, "it is not a bug, it's a feature", e.g. "walled garden life". Imagine if you bought a Microsoft Surface and you could only use the Windows Store to download apps on your device.. People would be outraged, but since it's Apple it is "expected"...

Hint, if it is expected, that doesn't mean it's still ok..

Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by eddieroger on Friday June 19, 2020 @08:00PM (#23580191)
It’s their store, and they get to pick what’s in it. If you want stuff not available in that store, you need a new store. You own the phone, but you agreed to only load software on it from the one store, as it has been for the last decade.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by TedDoesntTalk on Saturday June 20, 2020 @01:57AM (#23582059)
No, they need to allow other stores with different rules and different pricing models. If not, then their store needs to drop the anti competitive practices. This is what the EU investigation is about.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by eddieroger on Saturday June 20, 2020 @11:17AM (#23584402)
Until the EU decides, they don’t need to do anything. And when the EU decides, if they decide it’s not anti-competitive, they get to go back to doing nothing. You have a choice of what device you use, and if you don’t like all of the things that come with Apple products, vote with your money and use something else.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by jpttsn on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:42PM (#23580055)
When you bought the device, did you expect it to run “Hey”? If Apple promised that, sue them. If not, you’re just confused about what you bought and probably shouldn’t handle your own money.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by pmiller2 on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:47PM (#23579637)
You can override their decision by jailbreaking your phone.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by iSoron on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:01PM (#23579739)
If Apple provided an official jailbreaking tool, I would actually consider this a valid solution, even if it voided the warranty on the device.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by quitethelogic on Friday June 19, 2020 @10:11PM (#23580934)
Perhaps that's the one more thing at WWDC next week.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by scarface74 on Friday June 19, 2020 @06:57PM (#23579705)
BaseCamp is free to offer in app subscription and charge 43% more than directly on their website.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by tempestn on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:21PM (#23579885)
Yeah, they just can't have anything in the app mentioning that they're doing so. That doesn't sound very user-friendly either.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by scarface74 on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:22PM (#23579904)
Yes because most retailers like Best Buy let manufacturers advertise that you can get products cheaper at Amazon....
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by tempestn on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:34PM (#23579989)
Best Buy also doesn't require you to sell your software in their store if you want people to be able to use it with the laptop they bought there.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by scarface74 on Friday June 19, 2020 @07:48PM (#23580101)
And neither does Apple. You are free to offer both in app and out of app subscriptions and charge different prices. You don’t have to sell your app in the App Store, you have to distribute it.
Re:You download the app and it doesn’t work by nodamage on Saturday June 20, 2020 @02:42AM (#23582260)
This makes me wonder if they could charge $99/year on their website but $999/year via in-app purchase. Basically a price so high that no one would realistically buy it from within the app.

It technically fulfills the requirements specified in the review guidelines but I suspect it would be frowned upon.