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Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by CalRobert on Friday May 01, 2020 @11:45AM (#23043218)
People are focused on the relatively small amount here, and that's valid, but I suspect that some of the incentive here is to keep momentum in cycling going (from people avoiding transit, enjoying temporary bike infra, etc.) and trying not to lose that progress. There might be a lot of people for whom that €50 means a tuneup that gets them to take the bike out when before it would've just rusted.

I mean, data would be nice, but that's the hope (I'm guessing)

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ogre_codes on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:41PM (#23043883)
Bikes tend to degrade slowly over time if you don't do regular maintenance. Most people don't notice the slow decline until it's quite bad when suddenly it feels like an unreliable POS.

Giving people who are just a little frustrated with their bike might go a long way to helping keep people from getting to that point at least once.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by cultus on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:51PM (#23044001)
This doesn't get enough attention in cycling promotion. One of the absolute biggest reasons that people aren't on their bikes is maintenance. Wheels go out of true, shifting gets wonky, and it starts to look like an unreliable form of transport.

Sturdier commuter bikes help a lot with this, but every commuter seems to think they need a bike with super-light wheels and a thin, weak 12-speed chain.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by adwww on Friday May 01, 2020 @03:08PM (#23045454)
> One of the absolute biggest reasons that people aren't on their bikes is maintenance

I wish that was the case.

The reason people are not on their bikes is because the roads are scary and we don't have nearly enough dedicated bike infrastructure.

(By "we" I mean the entire world with just a handful of European exceptions.)

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by zdragnar on Friday May 01, 2020 @07:27PM (#23047559)
Europe also has a very temperate climate compared to much of the world. My area many years goes from -40 to over 100F (or 38 if you prefer c). Public and private enclosed transportation must accommodate 100% of the population, because for half the year commuting by bike is fundamentally unsafe" whether by frostbite or heat stroke.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ogre_codes on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:53PM (#23044023)
One of the reasons I think people like the bike share programs. The bikes are burly and slow, but they get the maintenance they need where they usually don't end up truly horrible.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by loeg on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:17PM (#23044938)
In my experience they mostly don't get maintenance; they're just built extremely cheaply and treated as disposable. Various parts that are easy to break (derailleurs) are elided by using Internally-Geared Hubs (IGH). The wheels are non-pneumatic and just a solid piece of rubber, so they never go flat.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by lostlogin on Friday May 01, 2020 @03:12PM (#23045486)
> Internally-Geared Hubs (IGH)

Just so good. I wish they had more gears. My older one has 8, and I see more on newer ones but not a lot.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by akgerber on Friday May 01, 2020 @03:50PM (#23045842)
Dockless bikeshare bikes are often built as you describe.

Docked bikeshare (as mostly operated by Lyft in the US, formerly Motivate/Alta) generally uses bikes built similarly to high-quality Dutch city bikes and maintains them.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by loeg on Friday May 01, 2020 @06:00PM (#23046979)
Docked bikeshare is pretty useless in my experience, so despite the lower quality bikes I prefer the dockless model.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by dmoy on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:41PM (#23044566)
I guess this depends on the bike share program. I've definitely ridden my share of bike share bikes that were in very bad shape (and I have a fairly high tolerance for junkers).

The bike share program in question shut down and isn't available in my area anymore, so maybe that was just because they were cutting back.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by dmurray on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:35PM (#23045119)
The docked bikes in my city have way better build quality and maintenance standards than the undocked ones. They're both heavy but the undocked ones have chains falling off, broken shifters, etc. I expect it makes sense that these get less investment as they are easier to steal.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ogre_codes on Friday May 01, 2020 @06:30PM (#23047206)
If your bike chain breaks and you aren't hammering your bike on mountain bike trails, you've seriously neglected that bike for a long long time. Doesn't matter if it's 12 speed, 11 speed, whatever, bike chains are durable and last for years. Generally they are more likely to freeze up from rust and neglect than break. Clean the chain every few weeks and change it ~yearly (or every 2000 miles or so) and unless you are doing some burly stuff with your bike, it's not going to give you trouble.

Likewise wheels, even lightweight wheels aren't likely to fail on a commuter bike unless it's left in the weather.

The bigger danger to bikes is crappy builds and cheap-ass parts. A well made lightweight wheel is going to last 10 times longer than a cheap wheel. If you bought your bike at Walmart, if your chain breaks it's because it's more likely it's because the bike was badly out of tune when you bought it.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by cultus on Monday May 04, 2020 @09:56AM (#23068101)
Wheel rims are aluminum, and spokes are stainless. They don't rust. Low spoke-count wheels are weaker and will go out of true faster, especially on potholed roads and with panniers.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by analog31 on Friday May 01, 2020 @05:21PM (#23046629)
They don't. The days when competitive / sportive cycling drove the designs of bikes sold to casual riders have faded into the past.

The most widely sold bikes in the US are "hybrids," mountain bikes, and cruisers. Within the mountain bike category, the most popular ones are relatively simplistic and are mainly used on pavement or light trails. Those are all relatively sturdy bikes with reasonably wide tires. Bikes that are specifically sold for "commuting" sell poorly, even among commuters, for reasons that I don't fully understand.

I live in a relatively bike friendly town, on a street that's designated as a bike thoroughfare, and I commute by bike myself, and I'm curious about bikes. So I make a mental note of what people are riding. The most common type of commuter bike is "whatever was in the garage," often left over from college or some past market fad. The people I talk to about cycling tend to do remarkably little maintenance. Most decent consumer bikes are sold with puncture resistant tires these days, which are a great improvement.

Now, from my observation (my own bikes, helping friends, volunteering for bike charity), bikes that go out of whack frequently, were usually built out of whack. Low end bikes that are shipped from the manufacturer to the retailer with little or no expert intervention often have poorly adjusted spokes and bearings, sometimes missing lubrication, sometimes parts installed backwards, and so forth. This is unacceptable, but it happens. An initial tune-up that includes bringing the spokes up to proper tension, and adjusting / lubricating the bearings, will turn many the crappy bike into an OK bike.

I don't believe a zero-maintenance bike exists yet, though a couple of mine are close. One is single speed with a coaster brake. I live in a relatively flat town. I also bought a new bike a few years ago for about 500 bucks, that has been maintenance free except for a puncture or two, and normal periodic adjustment of the brakes due to pad wear. It's a hybrid with 9 speeds, wide tires, and cable operated disc brakes. I love it.

But for this reason, I still recommend that a cyclist -- casual or enthusiast -- needs to develop basic maintenance skills. Simply being on the lookout for problems is often enough to catch problems before they progress beyond something just needing to be tightened.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by karatestomp on Friday May 01, 2020 @04:10PM (#23046027)
This is the only reason I don't ride anymore. I don't get why my complex car full of caustic liquids and burning them to drive a bunch of parts super fast can go tens of thousands of miles with nothing but oil changes and nothing breaks or doesn't work almost-like-new unless I run over a nail, but bikes? Ugh. Every time I go to get on it, something's broken. Flat tires constantly. Changing them sucks and takes forever (rear one, mostly). All the gear combos that ought to work never quite actually seem to. Something'll come loose during the ride, creating a safety hazard. And so on.

Give me a bike that doesn't break all the time or at least makes it super-easy and super-fast to fix any parts that do, and doesn't cost like $1,000 (why the actual hell should a decent one cost 1/20th as much as a lower-end car?! Think about what goes into both! How does that make any sense? 1/100 seems more reasonable, and for one that does not suck just like the $20,000 car probably does not suck remotely the same way a low-end bike does or it'd get lemon law'd away) and I'll go back to bike riding.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by thirdsun on Tuesday May 05, 2020 @02:21AM (#23077080)
If you experience flats, especially when they happen repeatedly, you should always look for the cause. Check the inner tube. When you find the hole check that position on the rim as well as the tire. Make sure that there aren't any sharp edges or objects. Don't go too low on pressure. Buy quality tubes and tires from manufacturers like Continental or Schwalbe.

Flats happen and are inevitable, but they should be a rare occurence. As a daily bike commuter and road bike enthusiast I experienced 2 flats in the last 10 years.

Futhermore most maintenance tasks are quite easy to handle and Youtube has excellent tutorials ready. I understand that this isn't for everyone (I'm not interested in learning how to repair my car for instance), but channels like GCN [1] explain a range of basic maintenance taks for anyone who's interested.

I also think your expectations towards bike prices are somewhat unreasonable. Maintenance is required at any price category, but generally 1000 € bikes will give you a decent entry level experience with quality parts that should last for years. Lower priced options will have to cut corners and cause frustations at some point.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/user/globalcyclingnetwork

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by michaelt on Friday May 01, 2020 @07:08PM (#23047430)
> Give me a bike that doesn't break all the time

What you need is a 'commuter bike' with an aluminium frame, Shimano Nexus 8-speed hub gear and Schwalbe Marathon Plus tyres. Should cost less than $500.

You'll need to pump up the tyres every 3 months, and have a bike shop service it every 2000 miles or so. But I've been riding this configuration twice a day for 5 years and had maybe 3 punctures in that time and no problems more severe than that.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Too on Saturday May 02, 2020 @01:41AM (#23049569)
Make sure to get disc brakes also! Preferably hydraulic but not necessary if you are on a budget.

Those old caliper brakes need constant replacement, constant adjustment, replacing them requires even more calibration, and tiniest little wobble in your wheel or dent in your rim will make the brake very erratic and wear quickly. I get bad shivers down my spine every time i see such brakes, knowing how much time and frustration I've wasted on maintaining them in the past.

Quality of bike components have gone up past decades so don't be hung up on old experiences. Build quality matters a lot so make sure to get a reputable brand also, not something from the corner of the hardware store, doesn't have to be their top of the line model though, something like 400-800€ should give you a good one.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Jenda_ on Friday May 01, 2020 @06:11PM (#23047070)
Regarding flats, try tires with Kevlar reinforcement. Flats went completely away since I switched to Maxxis Overdrive Maxxprotect. They are a bit heavy, but I think not having to care about flats is worth it.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Too on Saturday May 02, 2020 @01:50AM (#23049615)
Most flats come from not having enough pressure in the tire, causing friction between tire and tube when the inside deforms, especially when riding over curbs. Bad quality tubes and tires plus improper installation also contributes a lot.

Reinforcement in forms of kevlar and such might provide some additional protection but these types of penetrating punctures are rare in the first place. It obviously doesn't make things worse so for peace of mind and some extra protection could still be worth it anyway. Just the fact that these are high quality tires to begin with will help a lot.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Jenda_ on Saturday May 02, 2020 @05:40AM (#23050591)
I managed to find the cause of most flats - usually it was a small piece of glass or a small sharp stone (as used in winter on icy roads), still stuck in the tire. Maybe we have sharp roads and soft curbs in Prague :-)
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by kinkrtyavimoodh on Friday May 01, 2020 @04:49PM (#23046326)
Yeah it's annoying that you need to pay like a thousand bucks AND constant maintenance to have a joyful AND functional mode of conveyance that is so ridiculously simple compared to a car.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by karatestomp on Friday May 01, 2020 @06:01PM (#23046987)
I dunno, I just look at the one thing, then look at the other, and think that given what each does, the complexity, the sheer quantity of material, the price, and the reliability, it really seems like a bike that pretty much never breaks should cost about $300—maybe less, I'm allowing a fair amount for lower economy of scale, which I'm not actually sure is a problem—and you should be able to buy any bike around that price and expect that kind of quality.

When I go to use one of our cars and it doesn't work, or something goes wrong while I'm driving, that's very surprising. When we try to use one of our bikes and it's broken, or it breaks while riding, that's just... how bicycles are, I guess. Been that way since I rode (and constantly fixed) bikes as a kid. Was that way when I commuted on one for a while. They're just so very damned unreliable and fiddly.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by mb7733 on Saturday May 02, 2020 @01:52AM (#23049625)
If fixing a flat takes a long time, I might suggest that your technique could be improved. Even though it seems like a simple task there really is a "right way" and many "wrong ways". There are great videos/articles online.

It really shouldn't take longer than 3-5 minutes.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by throwaway41597 on Saturday May 02, 2020 @05:43PM (#23055164)
> It really shouldn't take longer than 3-5 minutes.

    - .5 min: flipping the bike
    - 1 min: finding the tools
    - 1 min: removing the wheel and chain
    - 3 min: removing the tire
    - 1 min: removing the tube
    - 2 min: locating the hole
    - 1 min: cleaning the tube
    - 5 min: applying glue and letting it dry
    - 3 min: installing the patch and holding it just to make sure
    - 2 min: putting back the tube
    - 1 min: putting back the tire
    - 5 min: putting back the wheel and making sure it doesn't touch any thing
    - 1 min: inflating
    - .5 min: flipping the bike back up

    Total estimated time: 27 min
    Actual time I take: ~60 min
Any advice, given that my bike is about 40 years old?
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by mb7733 on Saturday May 02, 2020 @10:23PM (#23056399)
My advice is to go to a bicycle co-op and ask them for pointers. Do not take this as an insult -- I really believe you could benefit greatly from some instruction or a demonstration. If there are no bicycle co-ops in your area, reach out to a knowledgeable friend. Or I can recommend some videos but they are not hard to find. There is _absolutely no way_ that it should take you an hour to fix a flat tire on a bicycle, given the right technique.

(For example, it should not take 5 minutes to replace a wheel. That should take about 10 seconds... I am genuinely curious what you spend your time doing over the 5 minutes and I am sure some practice / instruction could save you frustration. Likewise, even for a very tight tire you should be able to remove it quite quickly. A small tip I can give you for removing a tire is to make sure that the entire bead of the tire is unseated and sitting in the deepest part of the rim. This leaves a good amount of slack to pull the tire off. I usually am able to remove a tire without any tools, but a tire lever can make it even easier when used correctly.)

Certainly patching a tube adds to the time, I didn't include that in my 3-5min estimate. The usual practice is to pack an extra tube while out on a ride and patch the damaged tube later at home. Also worth noting there are modern patches that come with adhesive pre-applied that are very easy & quick to use, just peel and stick.

Cheers and good luck!

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by throwaway41597 on Saturday May 02, 2020 @11:15PM (#23056615)
No worries but to be clear, do you stand by your opinion for old bikes? The ones I maintain are decades old and those 5 minutes I mentioned easily turn into 30 minutes at times because of brakes and guards working together against me. I've always considered that time to be the price to pay to have a cheap, undesirable (to thieves) bike and your estimate is challenging my world views!

Regarding tire removal, I recently did it like three times in a single week. It was like 15 minutes in sweat and finger pain every time. To get an idea of what one can achieve, can you remove a tire without tools with fat tires only or even thin road tires? Mine were thin, 23mm (less than an inch). By the way, in this instance, it wasn't a beater but a high-end 1970s bike.

Thanks for the advice, I'll look into it because it sounds like I'm missing something.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by mb7733 on Saturday May 02, 2020 @11:38PM (#23056692)
Don't worry, nothing I said is specific to newer bikes. Definitely, older bikes can present unique challenges but swapping tires hasn't changed. (Unless you get into tubeless... I wouldn't recommend it for road riding...)

How difficult it is to remove or replace a tire really comes down to the tire/rim combinations. Different types and sizes of tires can make a big difference.

Some combinations can definitely be trickier to mount, but with the right it can usually be down without too much physical strain. Mechanics in the bike shop do it many, many times each day after all.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by loeg on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:16PM (#23044917)
12-speed chains are exclusive to the high end MTB space; no commuter bike is going to have that. Even high end road is still mostly on 11-speed. They're also not any weaker than wider chains:

https://bikerumor.com/2013/02/19/bikerumor-shimano-chainwear...

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by akgerber on Friday May 01, 2020 @03:53PM (#23045877)
One challenge for the sturdy commuter bike in the US is that cities are built around the car and commute distances are large, rewarding faster bikes. But reliability for commuters is certainly a big part of the recent boom in single-speed road bikes, which have thicker chains, dishless wheels, and no shifter to fail.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by loeg on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:14PM (#23044895)
And this is also true of cars, except the maintenance and parts on cars are much more expensive. Probably most Americans don't think much about this much as they drive and service their cars regularly.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by vadansky on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:05PM (#23044158)
Now you have me worried about what maintance I should be doing. Going to a bike shop once a year at the start of summer seems to have been enough for me. After a quick google search I got crazy suggestions that I should be changing my cables every 6 months.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by sybercecurity on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:20PM (#23044334)
Really depends on how much riding you do and the components on the bike. Back when I was younger and more fit and riding 100+ miles a week I did a lot of maintenance. Some of it was necessary like adjusting brake pads, cables that developed slack, etc. Some of it probably wasn't but gave me an excuse to tinker.

Now I'm riding less, I find I don't need to do as much except keep the chain clean and tires inflated. I still check cables, chain slack, and stuff but they tend to need less work now.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by thirdsun on Tuesday May 05, 2020 @02:38AM (#23077168)
You're probably fine with your annual tune up. If you want to do it yourself the drive train should be your highest priority in my opinion:

- Keep your chain clean. Every few weeks use a degreaser to clean it, wash it out with water and apply lubricant suitable to your weather conditions afterwards. There's a chain cleaning tool from Park Tools which makes the degreasing part particularly easy. I highly recommend it.

- Replace the chain every year. Chains will stretch and wear out the cogs on your cassette thereby deteriorating the whole drive train. There are distance recommendations and ways to mesure if it's time to replace the chain if you want to look them up, but doing it every year shoudl be on the safe side

- Replace your tires once they are worn out. I drive Continental Grand prix which come with a handy indicator on the tire itself, but you should be able to look up the recommended life span for your particular tyre

- Keep your bike clean. Cleaning your chain should be a welcome opportunity to also quickly clean the rest of your bike - doesn't have to take longer than a few minutes.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Phlogistique on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:19PM (#23044318)
If you are going to a bike shop once a year for maintenance, then you are doing the maintenance you should be doing.

But many people have old bikes with rusty brakes, non-working gearing, and just go on using them until they fall apart.

Also, different bikes require different levels of maintenance. And your riding style and frequency of use affects the speed of wear.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by loeg on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:19PM (#23044959)
Once a year is plenty unless you're having unexpected failures or a poor experience. If you're riding enough to go through parts faster than that, you'd know it.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by wtallis on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:27PM (#23044412)
If you commute by bicycle every day rain or shine, then changing the cables twice a year might not be as crazy as it sounds. I doubt that's enough time for them to rust to the point of being in danger of breaking, but it probably is enough time for them to collect enough grit to interfere with smooth shifting and braking. Though a lot of that will depend on how exposed the cables are on your particular bike.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by CalRobert on Saturday May 02, 2020 @02:32AM (#23049813)
I have a problem with spokes getting loose myself. Would love tuffwheels but for adult bikes.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by doyoureallytnot on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:14PM (#23043572)
I think this is exactly it. A lot of people have bikes already but they're a little run down and this might be the encouragement they need to get them fixed.

The fact is that most people can't do even the simplest repairs on their own bike and if their bike is run down then they're less likely to use it.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by analog31 on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:22PM (#23044349)
50 bucks is more than most of my bikes are worth. ;-)

But seriously I think that most bikes are within 50 bucks of being rideable. I tinker with a lot of old bikes, for family, friends, and at one time for a charity program. At least in the US, a huge fraction of bikes are gathering dust or rust, but the tires are flat, there's no pump in the house, some of the mechanisms are stuck, they haven't been properly adjusted for comfort, etc. Many of the bikes weren't properly built in the first place, and need attention to things like spoke tension and bearing adjustment. And the owners aren't handy with tools.

A bit of lube, air in the tires, and maybe a reassurance from the mechanic at a shop, and some accessories such as a pump, will have the bike up and running. At the very least it will help the shops stay afloat.

If the subsidy kicks in all at once for a lot of people, it could trigger a noticeable increase in bike use, which has a crowd psychology benefit.

For everybody, my consistent advice is that your experience with any kind of cycling will be greatly improved by becoming self sufficient for at least routine maintenance and minor repairs.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by aplummer on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:05PM (#23043462)
If you’re right that money in a public health system will pay back dividends I imagine.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by BurningFrog on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:41PM (#23045171)
My cynical read is that the bike rider/repair lobby was one of the groups at the table, and this is what they managed to get.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by duxup on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:08PM (#23043503)
Is anyone really waiting for €50 to use or not use their bike on a regular basis?

I'm highly skeptical.

This seems like it will just benefit folks already doing it anyway.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ploika on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:20PM (#23043646)
Absolutely. There are plenty of people who have a bike with a flat tyre and a rusty chain and no lights or whatever. They might go back to taking the bus or metro, but if they were offered a free service (effectively) to make cycling a viable option, they'll take it.

I know loads of people who cycle to work because of Ireland's Bike To Work scheme. They can all afford a bike without help, but the extra incentive was enough to get them to start cycling.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by wolco on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:24PM (#23043704)
Would they go through all of that in the hopes of getting upto $50.00?
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by fluffything on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:42PM (#23043884)
Through all of what?

Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop?

With 50 EUR, every bike shop does the usual tear fixes: changing tubes, adjusting gears and brake levers, changing break pads, changing the handlebar tape, centering the wheels, and cleaning / oiling.

Those 50 EUR can't cover major damage, but lots of people in Europe have multiple bikes in their basement that are just "rusty" / flat tire / etc. and that they didn't needed during the winter.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Y-bar on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:58PM (#23044077)
> Walking your bike 200m to the closest bike shop?

This also illustrates a secondary benefit of these €50, namely that bike repairs are hyper-local. In addition to making bike repair more affordable for some and helping keep the momentum going on bike commuting, these euros can also drive more commerce to local small repair shops, helping them stay in business.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by adambard on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:42PM (#23043891)
On July 11, 7-11 offers a free slurpee to all customers. The free slurpee cup is a fraction of the size of any of the already-very-cheap options available for sale.

I have seen lineups out the door and around the block on this occasion. I think this illustrates very well people's well-known tendency to irrationally value free stuff.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by zxexz on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:51PM (#23044006)
I would. I also want to point out that you seem to be trivializing what most people would consider a non-trivial amount of money. That's easily a month of groceries for one person.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by smeyer on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:15PM (#23044275)
I agree that $50 shouldn't be trivialized. That being said, in America that's well below the standard for a month of groceries for one person (unless they're eating all of their meals out or something like that). Here[0] are the USDA food plans with budgets for "food at home". The cheapest category is "thrifty", and even there they budget about $100 per month for a one year old through about $190 for an adult male (those numbers increase by about 20% if it's a one person household rather than a contribution to a family budget).

I don't know how those numbers might compare in France, and there are obviously cheaper parts of the world, but the person trivializing $50 might well be in America where that's closer to a week's grocery than a month's for one person.

[0] https://fns-prod.azureedge.net/sites/default/files/media/fil...

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by zxexz on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:58PM (#23044729)
Thanks for the link! Perhaps I should have said $50 is a sizable chunk of a monthly grocery budget.

For about a year when I was 19ish I managed to get by on $50-ish/month for groceries, by mainly living off rice and beans, with some eggs and other items thrown in. I don't know if that counts though because I got a lot of goods from dumpsters as well; Whole Foods throws out a lot :O

Now I'm way less frugal when it comes to groceries, probably closer to 3 or 4 times that. And I would still take that $50 for bike repair.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ORioN63 on Friday May 01, 2020 @03:28PM (#23045619)
Not sure why you were downvoted.

When I was in college, I also didn't have much more than 50€ for groceries. I did fine, but I also lived in walking distance to everything. Not everyone is as lucky.

Do people think poor people don't commute? 50$/€ is def. a lot for a myriad of people.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Noos on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:25PM (#23044395)
Its rare that you bike somewhere you can't just walk to. If you are that poor to need a government handout to fix it, you don't need it just for the bike.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ploika on Friday May 01, 2020 @02:06PM (#23044808)
I can cycle to work in about 20 minutes, or walk to work in about 70 minutes. Cycling is convenient for me, walking is not.

Viewing this is as poor people needing a government handout is a very strange interpretation of what's being proposed. It's a public health and environmental nudge.

It's like when sugar taxes are discussed, and everyone says "why don't they make the healthy things cheaper?" Well now getting a bike serviced is being subsidised. But again, it's not even about the money really.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by warp on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:55PM (#23044703)
That's ridiculous. A 35 minute commute on a bicycle is a 2 hour walk.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by jxcl on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:13PM (#23043556)
Maybe not, but a properly tuned and lubricated bike is waaaayyyyy more pleasant to ride and may help to encourage increased bike use. It's easier to do stuff when it's pleasant.
Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by doyoureallytnot on Friday May 01, 2020 @12:16PM (#23043589)
I really think so.

We had a pop-up bike repair workshop come around every month at my last place of work and it really increased bike use in the area.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by Noos on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:15PM (#23044268)
"keeping cycling going" is much less important than spending that money to deal with job loss and unemployment. This is using a crisis to divert money to a person's pet agendas.

if you want to subsidize cycling and stuff, can we at least get the economy back up first and deal with the massive fallout from lost wages due to time off, and business closings?

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by ploika on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:44PM (#23044607)
Where I live, cycling is much cheaper than public transport and astronomically cheaper than driving. If you have lost wages and still have to go places, that's important.

You're assuming that there's a choice between supporting an economic recovery and supporting cycling. I don't believe there is, certainly not when it comes to return on investment for €50 per person.

I see increased mobility, decreased congestion in towns and cities, less pollution and less income lost to transport costs, not to mention the health benefits from more exercise.

Re:France offers each cyclist €50 for bike repairs once lock... by icebraining on Friday May 01, 2020 @01:45PM (#23044618)
I don't see a "than" here. These vouchers are also a cash injection into French businesses and workers, and specifically ones who are both important from a policy standpoint and yet likely to get heavily beaten by the crisis, since everyone delays repairs in a crisis.