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Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by bryanrasmussen on Sunday April 19, 2020 @02:25PM (#22917759)
I am surprised at this statement of Italians having a higher median wealth, I guess that must all be the older generations since the last decade at least is all about how poorly the younger generations are doing - do you have a source for this assertion?

Also in the case of the ESM I guess you are accurate that they were offered money that they didn't want, but you didn't note why they didn't want it, which I guess is probably important https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-...

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by s9w on Sunday April 19, 2020 @02:54PM (#22917945)
The conditions of the ESM is more or less the entire point. They were offered the money they need - with some guards attached. But they wanted more, and not just borrowed but entirely given by the EU (=Germany). With no oversight. And they got that by calling Germany Nazis. That's despicable.
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by wz1000 on Sunday April 19, 2020 @04:58PM (#22918728)
> not just borrowed but entirely given by the EU (=Germany).

You can't have a workable monetary union without a fiscal union. Germany wouldn't have such a big surplus if its exports weren't massively boosted by the southern states depressing the exchange rate of the Euro. Unions require unity, and if Germany feels like its pulling more than its own weight, it can exit. But you see exactly the opposite, Germany (at least nominally) states that its goal is to preserve the union, and this betrays the fact that the union brings massive advantages for the German economy. It is not out of a sense of benevolence and european solidarity, but of pure self-interest.

Well, if Germany and the North want the union to survive, they will have to treat it like a real partnership and respect and recognize the contribution of their other partners.

The current "solution" of bailing out Italy and Spain with even more debt on the condition of further future austerity will only lead to further instability, unemployment, discontent and financial ruin when the debts come due.

It is not a question of "solidarity" with the South. It is a question of whether the North recognizes the contribution of its partners to the union, and whether they can act in mutual self-interest to save it.

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by s9w on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:04PM (#22918775)
Unified debt was explicitly forbidden in the EU contracts. It was one, of not the major selling point for the euro.
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by wz1000 on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:10PM (#22918820)
If that does not change, the Eurozone is a doomed project.

In a monetary union, the regions running a surplus enjoy a massive boost due the exchange rates being depressed by the regions running a deficit, while the industries of the deficit regions struggle to catch up, hampered by the lack of natural corrective forces of a floating exchange rate. If a monetary union has to work, the deficit regions have to be fiscally supported by the surpluses generated elsewhere, or they just spiral further and further into debt, unemployment and industrial collapse.

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by pinkfoot on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:16PM (#22918865)
How is the value of the Euro depressed? It was launched at 1:1 parity with the dollar.

$1 now buys you a mere €0.92

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by wz1000 on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:27PM (#22918936)
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by wz1000 on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:21PM (#22918898)
That is not how this works. The value of the Euro is depressed compared to what it would be if the deficit running regions were not part of the common currency.
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by pinkfoot on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:33PM (#22918979)
Ok, but surely thats true with the dollar too? Some states depress the value the dollar would have if only NY and California were in the Union?
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by wz1000 on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:40PM (#22919012)
Yes, it is true, but the difference is that the US is also a fiscal union, which is not the case with the EU, making it fundamentally unworkable in its current state.

https://blogs.imf.org/2018/02/21/the-euro-area-needs-a-fisca...

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by bryanrasmussen on Sunday April 19, 2020 @03:30PM (#22918185)
> but entirely given by the EU (=Germany) So the EU equals Germany?
Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by _0ffh on Sunday April 19, 2020 @03:53PM (#22918313)
Yeah, they got caught in a bit of hyperbole there!

Yet, if you take the 2017 budget [1] for example, nearly half of the net contributions (excluding the UK) were paid by Germany.

[1] https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-48256318

Re:With broad, random tests for antibodies, Germany seeks pa... by s9w on Sunday April 19, 2020 @05:02PM (#22918758)
It's not gonna be 100% Germany, that was hyperbole of course. But it's going to be the overwhelming majority, as it all too often is.