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Re:Crypto AG by hn3333 on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:35AM (#22309609)
Personally, I do however have more faith in the secret agencies of western democracies than China. So all things being equal, right now I'd prefer Americans and Germans spied on me.
Re:Crypto AG by DennisP on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:42AM (#22309688)
I'd rather be an American spied on by American secret agencies, than a citizen of China spied on by China.

However, as a citizen and resident of America I'd rather be spied on by China, because it's a lot easier for my own government to make trouble for me.

Re:Crypto AG by whatshisface on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @11:16AM (#22310042)
Further, you are likely to get people to rally against China's spying, whereas a significant fraction of Americans want you to be spied on (because they can't distinguish between the people and their government).
Re:Crypto AG by eska on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @12:23PM (#22310677)
The American government is not going to steal your company's secrets and give them to other companies, the Chinese government in fact does.
Re:Crypto AG by siv- on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @03:56PM (#22312725)
The US has also engages in economic espionage.
Re:Crypto AG by Areading314 on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @11:31AM (#22310200)
Dont be so sure. Plenty of retribution can be achieved online and unlawfully
Re:Crypto AG by janvidar on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:43AM (#22309706)
Isn't this just a "...but, I have nothing to hide" argument?

The values of the regimes in control are transient and ever changing. You might be okay with it right now - but maybe not in the near future.

Re:Crypto AG by taborj on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:50AM (#22309773)
Rights once given away are nearly impossible to get back. All rights, I might add, not just your right to privacy. You may not care about <thing> today but at some point in the future, you may.
Re:Crypto AG by darawk on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @11:03AM (#22309900)
Not really. There is an important difference, in my opinion, between covert surveillance conducted for national intelligence purposes, and surveillance conducted for run of the mill police purposes.

There is no real way around the fact that national intelligence agencies need to conduct mass surveillance of various kinds. National intelligence is a competitive zero sum game, and if we don't do it, others will, and we'll be at a disadvantage.

The same is not true for policing, however. The real danger to citizen rights is when the crossover happens. I'm not worried when the CIA spies on me - i'm worried when the FBI does. I'm worried when the tools of international intelligence get turned to more mundane matters. And I think that is the transition that we have to fight tooth and nail. Fighting the "don't spy on me NSA" battle was lost decades ago, and you were never going to win anyway in any material way. Because even if you could stop the NSA from doing it, every other government in the world would be doing it.

What we need to do is fight to keep that surveillance contained within the international intelligence mission, and not let it creep into domestic policing.

Re:Crypto AG by blotter_paper on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @11:11AM (#22309983)
If they wanna spy on us without warrants, they should amend the constitution about it; until then, it's treason.
Re:Crypto AG by dlsso on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:49AM (#22309764)
Really? Your local government has far more power over you than China does. I wouldn't be nearly as worried about China unless I was worth stealing from, assassinating, or something like that.
Re:Crypto AG by mytailorisrich on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:56AM (#22309828)
Neither China, Germany, nor the USA care about you enough to spy on you.

They only care about what is valuable to protect and advance their geopolitical and commercial interests, which are remarkably similar.

Crypto AG was gold because their products were used by governments and perhaps high level business executives.

Re:Crypto AG by denzil_correa on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:48AM (#22309758)
It’s almost a False Dilemma - you shouldn’t have to choose between the bad and the worse.
Re:Crypto AG by tiborsaas on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:51AM (#22309787)
I don't have any trust in any secret agencies :) Their job is literally to deal with all the shady stuff you don't want to see in the news.
Re:Crypto AG by hatenberg on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:48AM (#22309753)
If someone spied on me, I think it being a government in another country not collaborating with my own and very busy keeping up with their own population seems preferabke
Re:Crypto AG by sorokod on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @11:49AM (#22310372)
Individuals are not the targets here, states are and their preferences may differ according to the prevailing winds of international politics.