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Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by lghh on Sunday December 15, 2019 @06:09PM (#21799627)
Why is that? And, alternatively, who would you trust?
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by SmirkingRevenge on Sunday December 15, 2019 @06:16PM (#21799652)
Russia is a malevolent authoritarian regime. Russian companies (like Chinese companies) have no power to resist the dictates of their authoritarian governments. I don't trust anyone completely, but democratic countries where government authority is checked/constrained by the people and competing forces are far more trustworthy.
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by grzm on Sunday December 15, 2019 @06:24PM (#21799690)
At least some of Jetbrains' offerings are open source. If you have security concerns, you may be able to alleviate some of them by your own examination.

I'd also encourage you to consider separating your concerns about the Russian government and individuals living in Russia, just as you might other governments and their citizenry.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by SmirkingRevenge on Sunday December 15, 2019 @06:38PM (#21799739)
> At least some of Jetbrains' offerings are open source. If you have security concerns, you may be able to alleviate some of them by your own examination.

Good points

> I'd also encourage you to consider separating your concerns about the Russian government and individuals living in Russia, just as you might other governments and their citizenry.

I do separate them, in a moral sense. But in a practical sense, Russian companies can't really be separated from their authoritarian government. What can they do to resist? There are no checks and balances. To be fair, Jetbrains was probably even around before Russia even started to settle definitively into its current authoritarian predicament. But thanks to the Putin regime, how on earth can they be trusted?

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by tunesmith on Sunday December 15, 2019 @07:02PM (#21799844)
In a practical sense, how could JetBrains' software compromise security? People don't generally deploy build artifacts built from IDEs. And I suppose you could turn on a network monitoring tool to see if JetBrains software is broadcasting anything.
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by SmirkingRevenge on Sunday December 15, 2019 @07:22PM (#21799923)
Access to developer workstations (and all their permissions) is desirable on its own, even if you aren't modifying the specific projects they are working on.

Telemetry features (on by default) can/could be used to obfuscate nefarious network chatter.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by asdfasgasdgasdg on Sunday December 15, 2019 @06:39PM (#21799748)
> I'd also encourage you to consider separating your concerns about the Russian government and individuals living in Russia, just as you might other governments and their citizenry.

That's a big ask, because the Russian government's relationship with its citizenry is very different from the relationship of a free country's government with its citizens. Namely, I am confident that there is substantially zero risk that my country might compel me through extra-legal channels to modify my work product to target a foreign adversary. If they did, I would have many avenues to resist them, including the courts and the free press. But we know that this is not the case in Russia, being that they have neither rule of law nor a truly independent media. And we know that the head of that country is at best a violent and evil man, and so is an entity to be feared by those whose interests are misaligned with his.

So, as much as we might want to, it's not quite possible to separate the risks imposed by the Russian government from individual Russian people.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by Aeolun on Sunday December 15, 2019 @07:22PM (#21799925)
> And we know that the head of that country is at best a violent and evil man, and so is an entity to be feared by those whose interests are misaligned with his.

I’m not quite sure which country you were talking about?

While I agree with your general point, it just occurred to me that that could be applied to both leaders. It’s the country and the structure of that country that is different (e.g. leaders will change, vs not).

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by asdfasgasdgasdg on Sunday December 15, 2019 @07:40PM (#21800000)
I hate Trump as much as the next guy, but he has not annexed any provinces of Canada or Mexico, nor has he ordered the assassination of journalists or opposition party members. Maybe he would in a different timeline, where the U.S.'s rule of law was as frail as Russia's is. Maybe, although I happen to believe he is not quite that bad. Fortunately we don't live in that timeline, in any case. How evil the guy at the top is matters more to the degree his acts are unconstrained by the rest of the system.
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by c-smile on Sunday December 15, 2019 @10:27PM (#21800599)
> but he has not annexed any provinces of Canada or Mexico

But he already expressed intention to get Greenland, no?

Yet something tells me that if, say, Mr. Obama did present Point Roberts ( https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Point+Roberts,+WA+98281,+US... ) to Canada (as Khrouschev did with Crimea) then nothing would stop Mr. Trump to take it back.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by antipropaganda on Monday December 16, 2019 @12:12AM (#21800942)
The US has annexed parts of Mexico before : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_Cession. Also, accusations about Putin ordering the 'assassination of journalists or opposition party members' are not proven beyond reasonable doubt. Read about the long history of western anti-Russian sentiment and propaganda here : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Russian_sentiment
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by asdfasgasdgasdg on Monday December 16, 2019 @01:01AM (#21801094)
> The US has annexed parts of Mexico before

Whataboutism. And, yeah, that was super bad. So, for that matter, was the whole colonial era. But none of those guys are still the leaders of nuclear-capable nation states, so they're a little less relevant than Putin to our prospects going forward.

> are not proven beyond reasonable doubt.

This is not a court of law. My standard for "observing events as likely true on internet comment threads" falls somewhere below "beyond a shadow of a reasonable doubt" and somewhere above "preponderance of evidence." But I'd say for these cases we're way closer to the former than the latter.

> Wikipedia link.

On the other hand, Russian nationalists and apologists of Russian politics are sometimes criticised for using allegations of "Russophobia" as a form of propaganda to counter criticism of Russia.[14][15]

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by antipropaganda on Monday December 16, 2019 @01:08AM (#21801109)
> Whataboutism

The argument here is that USA cannot claim moral high ground when USA is actively committing the same act. Blindly claiming whataboutism without even attempting to refute this argument and is, therefore, a form of intellectual dishonesty.

> This is not a court of law, so that's kind of irrelevant.

It is important to make reasonable arguments in defense of your claims even outside courts of law.

> On the other hand, Russian nationalists and apologists of Russian politics are sometimes criticised for using allegations of "Russophobia" as a form of propaganda to counter criticism of Russia.

This is neither here nor there. This whole argument is inconclusive.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by asdfasgasdgasdg on Monday December 16, 2019 @07:55AM (#21802660)
> The argument here is that USA cannot claim moral high ground when USA is actively committing the same act.

I guess I just don't consider an annexation from the 1840s to be "active" the same way I think of one from the 2010s.

> Reasonable arguments outside court

Sure. And I think most reasonable external observers agree that Putin has likely ordered the assassination of at least several of his critics.

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by Bendingo on Monday December 16, 2019 @01:10AM (#21801118)
> zero risk that my country might compel me through extra-legal channels to modify my work product

I assume therefore, that you must not be Australian [1]

[1] https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2018/12/new_australia...?

Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by EugeneOZ on Monday December 16, 2019 @01:54AM (#21801254)
How quickly you forgot Edward Snowden.
Re:JetBrains: $270M revenue, 405K paying users, $0 raised by pnako on Sunday December 15, 2019 @11:41PM (#21800855)
Right. I refuse to use Russian software on my computer made in China!