News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by jstrong on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @12:06AM (#21394602)
> e.g. equity trading
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by narrator on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @12:58AM (#21394794)
As much as I liked to get excited bout these kinds of papers:

"Recomputing the AlphaGo Zero weights will take about 1700 years on commodity hardware."

[1] https://github.com/leela-zero/leela-zero

Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by fnbr on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @02:22AM (#21395087)
Yeah, but that's an embarassingly parallel task, so you can recreate it with sufficient resources. If there's a sufficiently lucrative application, businesses will happily pay that.
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by dmurray on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @05:34AM (#21395899)
And it's already been done for the chess version, in a community effort[0]. Well, "recomputing the weights" isn't plausible for a neural network of this size, but computing weights that give the network a similar level of performance.

[0] https://lczero.org/

Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by narrator on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @08:00AM (#21396709)
One thing I think that will be critical to the future of software is community efforts to build deep neural nets that match the AI power of the big companies.
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by pixelpoet on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @06:03AM (#21396034)
There are newer approaches where specialising for the problem domain (Go) gets you a 5-100x speedup: https://github.com/lightvector/KataGo/
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by make3 on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @01:03AM (#21394807)
Indeed that's a weird thing to say, especially since AFAIK AlphaGo is for (very large) discrete search spaces (where Monte Carlo Tree Search would be used), & equity trading doesn't strike me as a discrete search space.. is it ?
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by dmurray on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @05:40AM (#21395924)
Yes? At any point in time you can buy or sell a discrete number of shares in a finite universe of stocks.

The bigger difference in equity trading is that it's a "game" of hidden information with asymmetric and maybe unknown payoffs. Of course, computers are pretty good at trading stocks, too, but I can say confidently AlphaZero won't be the most useful approach.

Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by make3 on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @03:10PM (#21401366)
A part missing in your analysis is that time is involved in the decisions, and that time is continuous, and that time is very important
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by falcor84 on Saturday November 02, 2019 @07:17AM (#21427024)
Is time really continuous in this case? I have absolutely no idea how it's implemented in practice, but would assume that stock exchange computers use some sort of game loop at a consistent rate.
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by degski on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @02:33AM (#21395131)
Sound is not discrete either, it does not seem to be a problem on computers, though.
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by make3 on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @03:25AM (#21395307)
That's the feature space, not the decision space
Re:Multiplayer AlphaZero by amitport on Wednesday October 30, 2019 @04:37AM (#21395622)
Well at least the second author, Tucker Balch, is a computational investing consultant / lecturer. I'm sure they'll continue to work this angle, even if it's not yet there.