If you consider automation to be sufficiently tech-y, there's still plenty of jobs like those around, particularly in the rust belt. The people I knew in this area lived in small towns and got paid well enough to live in neighborhoods surrounded by medical doctors.

Part of the problem is these jobs don't have the sex appeal of SV tech so they aren't on people's radar or just not considered desirable because of the nature of manufacturing work.

the sweet spot in terms of arbitrage right now is: find full time employment at a high earning job in a major metro area, move far enough from that metro area to work remote while being able to come into the office a handful of times per month.

A three hour commute is easier when you only do it twice a week, or a few times a month.

If you want to be mind-numbingly bored, sure. Despite the cost of living in a city, I (and others who enjoy city life) would much rather pay to enjoy amenities like public transit and being able to walk to a bar.

I don't think its fair to say that living outside a city has to be boring. Many value and enjoy being among nature. My ex-coworkers who live in rural areas seem to have a good time on their quads, tending their gardens that sometimes approach small farms, hiking/biking, boating on the lake in summer, ice fishing in winter, hunting, camping, etc.

Your Friday night at a bar is their Friday night around a fire with their hounds.

>Many value and enjoy being among nature. My ex-coworkers who live in rural areas seem to have a good time on their quads,

Listening to an extremely noisy engine for hours on end is not my idea of "enjoying nature".

I've lived in rural areas. They generally suck, even for nature. In America, all the wooded land is "POSTED" (no trespassing), so you can't go there, and will probably be shot if you do; you have to find a park instead. If your rural house is located near a park, great, but otherwise you're out of luck.

I dislike bars, clubs, people in general.

I like outdoors, silence, beach.

I feel miserable around all the other "robots" in the city.

I feel decent enough in the suburbs with less people and more space.

I actually am thankful for folks who think living outside a major metro area is "mind-numbingly" boring. That means you'll stay in the city with all the other crazy people.

See, these low-effort insults work both ways!

Cool. And thanks for car-induced climate change. I can’t wait for the oceans to turn to acid so you can enjoy your homesteading fantasy.

"Estimates suggest that cities are responsible for 75 percent of global CO2 emissions, with transport and buildings being among the largest contributors."

https://www.unenvironment.org/explore-topics/resource-effici...

A 3 hour commute each way is not easy even when you do it only twice a week

Round-trip

But my weekly commuting is less than 5 hours total. And I live in the Seattle area. I will add before I switched jobs to one on the same side of the lakes as I live on, it was 10 hours / week ;-)

Why isn't a 1 hour commute enough to find cheap land/housing?

At least where I'm at, those areas have already been built out at least twenty years ago. So unless you want to buy a McMansion, housing isn't cheap.

In the grand scheme of things, even $200K is not a lot of money. I made record this year (~$320K), but I end up saving it all. Can I afford to buy a home? Absolutely. Will I buy a home? Absolutely not. Let’s say I purchase an $650K home outside Seattle and commute to work. I still have a huge mortgage weighing on my shoulders and I could get wiped out if my employer let me go. Just not worth the risk.

Even in small towns $500 won’t get you much. A small, old, place in a marginal part of town.

It was walking distance from the local university + local hospital. My sister at the time was studying to be a medical doctor, so she needed to be close to those two spots.

There wasn't much else going on in the town aside from the university + hospital.

What kind of "small town" are we talking about? Most "small town"s I think of don't have universities. Maybe a community college for the whole county.

Well, its all relative ain't it.

Lets just say... Buies Creek, North Carolina. I've been to smaller towns, but I'd say population of 2,942 is small for most people. EDIT: Seems like prices may have gone up in recent years: I'm seeing $800 to $1000 on Rent.com, but there's still a listing or two for $600/month. Or maybe "word of mouth" is still king there.

Buies Creek is still reasonably close to the Raleigh metropolitan area. So this is still "somewhat suburban". I've visited my cousins in Coulee City, WA (Population 562), so I know what "actually rural" looks like too.

Jeeeez, rental prices in the States are INSANE.

I live in a dense urban area of ~1 million, on a tropical island. My 550 sqft apartment is ~$520. Hardwood floors, natural gas range and hot water, structure is proof against typhoons up to Category 5 (already experienced several), as well as earthquakes. Gigabit fiber optic internet @$35/month Speedtests around 550MB. Daily flights to practically every major city in Asia.

HOUSES, however, are insanely priced. The mortgage rates are low (1-3%, slightly less than 1% if you are a government employee) but the principal is stratospheric for the size of home and land you are buying.

That's pretty impressive. I didn't think there were many cities with such good infrastructure and cheap housing prices.

Yeah, that's my point. $500 is going to be sketch.

I'm actually pretty familiar with Buies...my mom's family all lives in Sanford and used to drive through there.

I work for a company that does rental listings so I look at these numbers a lot.

Yeah - 30 miles outside Raleigh isn't really a small town, IMO. It seems more like a suburb.

Nah, I'd say it counts. Population is under 5,000. It's very much NOT Raleigh.

There is a meaningful difference between Buies Creek, NC and Coulee City, WA.

Its less about population size and more about distance from the urban center. Coulee City is a 2-hour drive from a major city (Spokane), while Buies Creek is maybe a 40-minute drive from a major city (Raleigh).

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From MY perspective, both Buies Creek and Coulee City are rural.

But from the perspective of someone who lives in Coulee City, they probably think Buies Creek is suburban (since it is commute-distance from a city).

> From MY perspective, both Buies Creek and Coulee City are rural.

Yeah - for a person who is adjusted to only living in big cities then sure. However, Buies Creek is 30 minutes away from the downtown of a city. It is not rural by almost anyone else's definition.

It'd be like saying Atherton, CA is rural because it's a "smaller" town of 7k people. Ignoring that it's within a 8 million population metro and within 30-45 minutes of a 1 million population sprawling city (San Jose) and another 800k+ densely populated one (San Francisco).

> Yeah - for a person who is adjusted to only living in big cities then sure

I've never lived in any big city. Literally never. Not even close, always 20+ minutes away from the major city.

The thing is: suburbia itself is a network of smaller cities. Buies Creek has no "smaller city" near it. Buies Creek IS the city.

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To continue your Atherton example... Atherton is a suburb of ___Palo Alto___, not a suburb of San Fran. It is a brisk 4-mile bike-ride from Atherton to Palo Alto and back, you don't even need a car if you live in Atherton and commute to Palo Alto.

There's NOTHING walking or biking distance to Buies Creek, NC. Rural is more about "distance from nearest metro".

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Buies Creek NC is 40-minutes to Raleigh. This is rural by my experience. True, Buies Creek NC is "less Rural" for people who are used to 2-hour drives (Coulee City to Spokane), but a 40-minute drive away from a big city is Rural by most people's definition of Rural.

> Not even close, always 20+ minutes away from the major city.

lol - this is so disconnected from how anyone who lives a truly rural lifestyle would think of it.

20 minutes is a joke! Living multiple hours away is considered more standard.

By whom?

99% of the rural population isn't Eastern Montana.

Atherton is 7,000 people. It's also 30 miles outside of SF. Is that rural then?

No, because its 4-miles away from Palo Alto (city of 60k).

Rural is mostly about being far away from urban centers. Buies Creek NC is 30+ miles from its nearest population center (10k+ citizens). While Atherton is 4-miles away from its nearest population center (60k+ citizens in Palo Alto).

It has a population center of 20k within 15 miles. That was only one that I looked at. I didn't even have to try for that. I know nothing about that region but at an eagle eye's glance, it's obviously a suburb. It's part of an incorporated metropolitan area. It is, therefore, a suburb. It is not rural. Atherton isn't a suburb of Palo Alto btw. Palo Alto is the suburb.

Can I say how much you've moved the goal posts here? The original post was about some place that wasn't a "big city", not an isolated rural farm.