Are you not highlighting another problem.

Buttons are always in the same place, I know where they are, I don't have to go hunting for the thing that used to be there, but is now in a sub sub menu, meanwhile you aren't looking where you're going.

Geez people. It's NOT a submenu.. You just move the scroll-wheel up and down or push it to turn it on/off. It's that simple. It's also the default behavior.

Here: https://youtu.be/_eyxkzaNZX0

Do you get it now? Taking your hands off the steering wheel involves more steps compared to this.

> Taking your hands off the steering wheel involves...

Taking your hands off the steering wheel has never been a problem. Taking your eyes off the road is.

That being said, if you want to set a certain temperature with analog controls, you still need to look at the number (showing the degrees). Still, in other cars you can see that number all the time, you don't have to go into some menu. There is a dedicated physical button for that one function.

I avoid looking at the number by turning the dial all the way down (so I know where it is) and then up to where I want it.

The video you linked contains menus and submenus.

Yes for other controls. But the DEFAULT scroll functions controls the A/C you can see that its the top item when pressing the menu NOT scrollwheel

I made that video because this keeps coming up, I know how it works...

Maybe for that one example. In general a changing UI is not a good thing whilst trying to concentrate on other things. It isn't about hands on wheel, its about mental load, a hardware button is muscle memory, I don't have to look at it, I don't have think about it.

Ahhh backpedaling now are we? The topic was about A/C control... Hence that's the specific video proof I provided.

> It isn't about hands on wheel, its about mental load, a hardware button is muscle memory, I don't have to look at it, I don't have think about it. reply

I don't have to look to use the scroll wheel controls too. Did you not see on the video that they are physical buttons? What's your point exactly?

Why am I backpedalling? The conversation is allowed to evolve, you're the one who raised the point about the changing UI.

"I don't have to look to use the scroll wheel controls too"

No you have to look at the screen, while you're trying to find the thing that was right there before the update.

> No you have to look at the screen, while you're trying to find the thing that was right there before the update.

Anecdotally speaking no... The item order have NOT changed from updates since 2012. I own the car and I am not speculating here. The UI change I mentioned was mainly aesthetic, similar to the iOS 6 to 7 color/look change.

I even said it should be the same even with the updates on my original post?

> The conversation is allowed to evolve

Sure, whine on

Give me physical buttons and knobs any day. I'm afraid with the direction that things are going, that may become more and more difficult, and go the way of crank windows and manual transmissions, however.

Oh well. The way that sticker prices keep going up on new pickup trucks, frankensteining old ones together and rebuilding the engines and transmissions is looking like more and more of a viable and cost-effective option.

Get yourself a horse and buggy. Time tested approach. Just watch out for the manure.

Fortunately, one by one, car manufacturers are starting to get over the entire touchscreen fad, for example Mazda: https://thenewswheel.com/mazda-eliminates-touch-screens/

I'm more than slightly annoyed that it starts with "choose menu"!!!

The demo person is constantly looking at his screen instead of in front of him.

For example, here is Audi's A/C controls in all of their new vehicles:

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1iETfhnSPY1JjSZPcq6xIwpXaw/ZWE...

You not only have to take a hand off the steering wheel, but also look to see which lever you want/need to press. If I'm changing the temperature I know where the dial is, but I also have to look to see what I'm setting it to.

I'm surprised people here think analog controls are a bulletproof solution to the same problems you're criticizing Tesla for. I have a hunch that if there were YouTube videos watching people change climate control settings in their car they'd not only be required to take hand off the wheel but also look down and away for a small period of time. Tesla's isn't perfect but you get to keep both hands on the steering wheel and head looking straight, but down ever so slightly.

We're criticizing bad UI design and the attitude that digital touch interface is automatically without fault and order of magnitudes superior to whatever was established in the last hundred years.

You can make bad UI with or without buttons.

Remember VCR clock controls?

I don't know if anyone has said digital touch is superior, I don't think it is. It's just a different way of solving the same problem. Can it be updated in the future unlike analog? Yep. Can you feel it with your hands like you can with analog? Nope.

I feel like I see more people saying first that digital is terrible and it should be analog, that they'll never get a car that has digital. The reasons they list are still true for analog though.

It doesn't matter if they "say" it. They act like they do and it speaks just as much.

Everywhere I look (modulo self bias) I find people that are in awe of the digital touch interface. In contrast I don't find people in awe of analog buttons. They just use them and complain when they don't work for whatever reason. Digital interface touch "buttons" don't work on cars. We complain. It's simple.