Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,' Not Climate

Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by davnicwil on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:33AM (#20775807)

Isn't that the commonly understood strategy of Tesla?

You can't start with the environmental benefits as the main selling point, it has to be a good car. Especially when Tesla started, the base cost of EV tech was extremely high, so the only market-competitive 'good' car you could build on top of it was a luxury car focused on optimising performance, comfort, brand, etc, with a very high price tag.

Obviously as the price of the base tech falls, a mass market car will emerge that's actually good, and sells, bringing the environmental benefits along with it not as a primary thing but a secondary one. That's the way it has to work (fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your perspective). Also seems that's exactly what Tesla is doing, I don't see any evidence to the contrary.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by PeterStuer on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:44AM (#20775863)

Any 'mass market car' can by definition not be good for the climate/environment. Cars, whether electric or other, are unsustainable.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by mensetmanusman on Friday August 23, 2019 @09:42AM (#20777491)

That is false in the case where the mass market dramatically improves global supply chains for batteries/storage. When the world has low cost batteries, solar energy will dominate due to the fact it is approaching order of magnitude lower $/kW costs than extraction fuels.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by irishloop on Friday August 23, 2019 @09:59AM (#20777669)

All of these cars use precious metals and resources which come from (probably) China who pollutes like hell to get them so who knows what the long-term ramifications are.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by xutopia on Friday August 23, 2019 @11:00AM (#20778319)

Pollution comes in various forms. Right now I'm less worried about heavy metals seeping into the land in some remote area of the world than I am about greenhouse gases. I'd rather fence off a square km to pollution for a dozen cars on the road that won't heat up the atmosphere more.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by ecpottinger on Friday August 23, 2019 @10:54AM (#20778247)

What precious metal in a BEV?

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by McWobbleston on Friday August 23, 2019 @11:13AM (#20778456)

Cobalt

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by scruple on Friday August 23, 2019 @12:18PM (#20779104)

The largest export of the DRC. [0]

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mining_industry_of_the_Democra...

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by asdff on Saturday August 24, 2019 @03:14AM (#20785761)

In what way is having a personal 3000lb pile of metal to wheel you around at all efficient? No matter if its gas or electric, 95% of that energy is squandered just moving around 3000lbs of metal everywhere you go in life.

Personal transport is best served on something you can actually pick up and carry. Buy an ebike. Lobby your city council for bike lanes. Anything else is opulent and destructive.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by manmal on Friday August 23, 2019 @06:27AM (#20776083)

Indeed, cars are bad for lots of reasons. But reducing nasty emissions and noise pollution, and making roads safer with various assistance systems, are improvements to the status quo. Since cars are here to stay (for now), improving them is worthwhile.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by H8crilA on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:51AM (#20775892)

While I agree in principle (maybe not that we should get rid of 100% of cars, but probably >90% of cars), there's no way we can do it quickly. And almost certainly not quickly enough to avoid +1.5 C, or very likely even +2.0 C. EVs are a good stepping stone.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by PeterStuer on Friday August 23, 2019 @06:01AM (#20775952)

I hear what you are saying, but let us not forget that today's mobility environment is a very recent phenomenon. In my opinion the 'change' required is presented as much more insurmountable than it is in practice.

Look at today's world vs the world just 3 decades ago. No mass Internet, no WWW, no mobile phones, no eCommerce, much more smoking, much less obesity, a vastly different financial system, ... Society is apparently extremely plastic in adapting to created changes.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by akiselev on Friday August 23, 2019 @10:25AM (#20777957)

>Look at today's world vs the world just 3 decades ago. No mass Internet, no WWW, no mobile phones, no eCommerce, much more smoking, much less obesity, a vastly different financial system, ... Society is apparently extremely plastic in adapting to created changes.

The effects of the internet and social media on political discourse already looks like a disaster, obesity is a result of changing food infrastructure and availability, and our financial system goes through a cataclysmic global hiccup every decade or two.

If this is what adaptation looks like, we're screwed.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by raaaaraaaa2 on Friday August 23, 2019 @07:10AM (#20776293)

On the other hand 1/2 of world looks more or less the same - rural Africa, india, china...

If you believe we are highly adaptable and new technologies will 'save us' somehow check this presentation : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkj_91IJVBk

...it's eye opening

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by read_if_gay_ on Friday August 23, 2019 @06:07AM (#20775974)

I find viewpoints like this to be overly regressive in the name of the environment.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by bytematic on Friday August 23, 2019 @12:57PM (#20779628)

Exactly, there are millions of people who won't ever buy a prius no matter if it fixes the environment, makes them more beautiful, and pays them

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by nothis on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:37AM (#20775829)

What I don't get is how the two are mutually exclusive. Singapore still has cars, right?

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by Sharlin on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:42AM (#20775855)

As other commenters have mentioned, personal car ownership is very much dis-incentivized in Singapore. It's a city-state so walking, biking, and transit are where it's at.

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by seanmcdirmid on Friday August 23, 2019 @08:53AM (#20776969)

More transit. It is a tropical city state, so walking and biking any amount of distance outside isn’t very pleasant during the daytime (and will require a shower and change of clothes if going to work).

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Re:Singapore Says Musk's Electric Cars Are About 'Lifestyle,... by maeln on Friday August 23, 2019 @05:58AM (#20775935)

Singapore really disincentives the usages of cars. Which is understandable when you have to cram 5 millions peoples on 722km2. Car, and especially car infrastructure take a lot of space. It is something you can afford when you have the space of the US or Canada, but when you are a small city states, public transportation makes a lot more senses.

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