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Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by listenallyall on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:02PM (#20658564)
Say what you want about Google/Alphabet as a whole, but Google Flights is incredible. It's absolutely amazing how quickly and largely that Google crushed all its competitors in terms of usability. Kayak, Hipmunk, Orbitz, Skyscanner were all my go-to's at one point but G.Flights is far superior in so many ways. It actually remembers your airline preference between searches. You don't have to beg or change settings to see a few days before or after... every search has a date grid and long-term graph, both which respond almost immediately to additional changes to date ranges. Searching multiple airports or destinations is super easy. Plus the calendar view, with lowest price for every day -- sure other sites have it but only for unfiltered searches. Google's calendar view is updated with every filter change.

There was a time in the 90s when eAAsySabre was publicly available to anyone, and text based searches were simple and fast and so easy. But Google Flights is even better, IMO.

Pretty amazing that sites entirely dependent on travel search seem satisfied with 10-year old UI while Google showed how much better it could be.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by aclimatt on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:46PM (#20658820)
I agree that its real-time inventory and pricing availability has been a total game changer in the UX department. Presumably their acquisition of ITA gave them the ability to respond to queries in real-time which enabled all of the (quite excellent) features you pointed out above.

There's just one problem -- because a ton of the data is cached, or precomputed, or however it's done, a substantial and frustrating amount of the data is simply wrong. As in, an unbookable flight. I spend probably an unreasonable amount of time searching for flights, and anecdotally I'd say about 5-10% of the results I get (not even for complex itineraries) either have a completely incorrect price, or are wholly unbookable on any website. Calling the airline doesn't count, because if their website doesn't have it, 99% chance neither will the call center.

For example, one from a few hours ago: https://www.google.com/flights/?f=0#f=0&flt=/m/01lfy./m/02_2...

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by cracauer on Friday August 09, 2019 @09:45PM (#20659648)
ITA's customers before the Google acquisition were not interested in sharing large infrastructure that would make contiguous querying (as opposed to on demand when a consumer searches), presumably mostly for cost reasons.

The QPX search engine is actually the same behind Google flights and all the airlines and what Orbitz used to use. The limitation pre google/flights was the on-demand querying only.

Now the contiguous querying, obviously, gives you a load of useful historical data. After running it for a couple of years now they seem to feel confident that they can predict prices changes with enough accuracy that the payouts for misses will be an acceptable price for the publicity, or increased use of their other travel products.

(disclaimer: ex-ITA/Xoogler, opinions my own)

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by CardenB on Friday August 09, 2019 @08:35PM (#20659394)
This is actually very difficult. The data has to be sourced from somewhere, which would be the airlines. The airlines have fragile backends that cannot handle much load. As a result, Google has to be very selective in their query volume, so they try to cache intelligently.

The result is that sometimes the information they display can be out of sync with airlines. You should notice this issue more on rarer flight routes.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by purple_ducks on Saturday August 10, 2019 @06:34AM (#20661279)
> The data has to be sourced from somewhere, which would be the airlines.

Such nonsense.

Pretty much all airlines don't own/run the source of truth for their flights and haven't for decades. They outsource that to GDS[1] such as Sabre and Amadeus. Their backends are not fragile.

You just have to pay for every query thus the caching.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_distribution_system

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by biztos on Saturday August 10, 2019 @01:12AM (#20660314)
I get the same thing (not sure to what percent level) and LOTS of times the price after I click through is not what Google listed by the link.

My solution so far is to search for broad prices for my approximate dates on Google, and when I see something promising open a new tab and go straight to the airline's site where I search for an actual offer for a specific flight.

I've found Google Flights super useful this way, though I guess they make less money on me than they could.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by jgalt212 on Friday August 09, 2019 @08:42PM (#20659420)
> Presumably their acquisition of ITA gave them the ability to respond to queries in real-time which enabled all of the (quite excellent) features you pointed out above.

Perhaps, but I was never impressed with Orbitz during its heyday. I remember watching a Google tech talk* about how hard a problem it is to give the searcher a viable set of options to chose from. However, in my experience, the viable set of options always seemed to include a 23 hr layover with with multiple connections that was $200 cheaper than the nonstop option, and various single connection 1hr layover options about $150 cheaper than nonstop. At the time, both Expedia and Travelocity offered a more reasonable set of options.

* can't seem to find it right now. Will post if able to locate later.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by asciimike on Friday August 09, 2019 @09:15PM (#20659542)
The talk you're looking for is probably this: http://www.demarcken.org/carl/papers/ITA-software-travel-com...
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by timdierks on Sunday August 11, 2019 @01:04PM (#20669102)
When this happens, go to https://matrix.itasoftware.com and find the specific itinerary you're looking for, which will give you the specific fare codes, etc. which you should use to book. I believe this ticket is available, it's just that the people you're speaking with can't find it in their system (that said, you don't say what fare you saw, so it's hard for me to be sure I see the same fare you do). Specifically, the bit under "Fare Construction".

Fare Construction (can be useful to travel agents) CPH SK X/MAN VS NYC 500.77HLHF06MN NUC 500.77 END ROE 6.637696 XT 161ZO 167UB 39YC 47XY 27XA 124US 646YQ

I wish that Google Flights would offer a way to get this info in the UI; it's not common but not greatly unusual to be in this position (where Flights can find the fare but the UIs available to consumers can't book it).

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by guiambros on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:45PM (#20658810)
(disclaimer: I work at Google, but no relationship with the Flights team other than as an individual user)

Funny story: just last week I was booking a complicated multi-city trip with 5 legs, multiple countries, etc. I tried several times via united.com, and it wasn't showing me any flights available in one of the legs (which I knew they had a codeshare agreement).

I went back to Google Flights, chose all my flights, selected "Book with United", and was able to finish the reservation on united.com (!), with all the flights properly populated, including codeshares.

It's remarkable that the integration between Google Flights and the airlines is better than even the airlines' websites themselves.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by chime on Friday August 09, 2019 @07:44PM (#20659129)
I’m not too surprised by this. The function of every form, wizard, walk-thru, or guided app is to end up with a blob of data to post to the backend. While the blob could be relatively simple, e.g. iCal for recurring event, the UI can be extremely complicated because every valid combination must be achievable but all invalid combinations must be blocked. Google Flights UI is better than United at coming up with the right data blob to post. Once the blob is created, United final page and backend have no problem parsing and posting it.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by CydeWeys on Friday August 09, 2019 @08:45PM (#20659438)
Sounds like a P/NP-type problem. It's quite a hard problem to calculate all possible permutations of routings and schedules across 5 cities ("NP"), and United's system clearly isn't up to snuff for it, while Google's is.

But validating and pricing any single itinerary is a trivially easy problem ("P"), so United can handle that no problem. It can't come up with the itinerary, but given a particular one, it will sell it to you.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by guiambros on Saturday August 10, 2019 @12:41PM (#20663048)
On multi-city trips, usually the UI allows the user to select each leg individually, so it is a very trivial problem (i.e., the same as 5 one way trips).

So no, there's no special magic here.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by danielscrubs on Saturday August 10, 2019 @02:48AM (#20660587)
I found out that Google Flights just have smaller time margins between flights. Might be something to look out for.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by telltruth on Friday August 09, 2019 @11:13PM (#20659915)
This has now become a pattern. Google throws resources on some execs whims, kills off competitors and after a while exec cashes out, thanks to their rewards system. The left over bunch then figures out that the thing is not as profitable so they must either kill off their own product or let it stagnate into oblivion. Customers now are left with dead bodies and long recovery period before investor fears wears off and replacements arrives. This scorched earth approach has left too many areas without good products, growth and investments.

Google Flights is destined to be on chopping block sooner or later. It has not much influence on core business and is not going to be wildly profitable. The problem is that by the time Google kills it, Kayak and other competitors would be forced in to unrecoverable comma or just outright killed off as well.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by listenallyall on Saturday August 10, 2019 @12:01AM (#20660060)
Was your last sentence written with the recognition that Kayak's parent company Booking Holdings (formerly Priceline) has an 80 billion market cap, and made 5.3 billion in operating profit last year? True, Google is 10x larger but Kayak has significant resources to compete.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by dastx on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:50PM (#20658842)
> Google Flights is incredible. It's absolutely amazing how quickly and largely that Google crushed all its competitors in terms of usability.

Really? I've yet to see a flight be cheaper or close to what the likes of Kayak and Skyscanner have provided.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by ulfw on Friday August 09, 2019 @09:44PM (#20659646)
You are right. In fact Google flights is regularly missing some airlines. Also the flights I found are often great on Google but then not available when actually trying to book, making the site quite a bit useless.

What sets it apart is the UI and fast search. But I guess with fast searching (caching) comes inaccurate results. It’s a thin line.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by wildrhythms on Friday August 09, 2019 @09:09PM (#20659528)
I'm always curious about where these sites source their prices from. Do the airlines provide a backend with real-time prices? Are they scraped from the frontend? Do these sites sell at a loss sometimes in "guaranteeing" a lower price?
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by dastx on Saturday August 10, 2019 @09:32AM (#20661920)
I've known of a service that actually provides APIs. I cannot remember what it is called but such services exist for hotels and holidays too.

Iirc I stumbled upon one of the flight tracking services by pure chance.

Having said that, I feel like Skyscanner at the very least has their own systems in place. There have been times where I've chosen a ticket, have gone through to the website that sells the ticket at the price, and just before it goes through, Skyscanner validates that the price still exists, and then bails saying the price has increased or decreased. Usually it's not by a lot, but it has happened.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by adamsvystun on Saturday August 10, 2019 @03:32AM (#20660718)
Have you tried Kiwi.com? I think they are still superior in some aspects of UI/UX than the competition. They allow you for example to select a range of dates for your departure/arrival instead of single date. They also give you ability to choose multiple departure/arrival points. And these points can be cities, regions or countries. I have not seen other websites that give you that kind of flexibility.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by gokhan on Saturday August 10, 2019 @06:43AM (#20661309)
Another vote for Kiwi. Using circles for to search in multiple departure locations is currently unmatched.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by grecy on Friday August 09, 2019 @07:08PM (#20658937)
It's funny, I've had exactly the opposite experience.

Multiple times flying from random places in Africa to Australia return, and Australia to Canada, GFlights was at least $1k more than the cheapest on kayak or orbitz.

Maybe GFlights just doesn't show overly cheap options..?

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by pb7 on Friday August 09, 2019 @09:43PM (#20659645)
Google Flights won’t show all OTA options, primarily the ones with unreliable reputations. SkyScanner, for example, will scrape the bottom of the barrel to find options to save that final couple of bucks (which is perfectly fine) but if you have problems with the ticketing post-booking, you will wish you didn’t go that route.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by jboydyhacker on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:54PM (#20658867)
It's actually not that amazing- they bought out ITA Matrix and just iterated on top of it.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by stefco_ on Friday August 09, 2019 @07:10PM (#20658945)
They added the last important missing feature from ITAMatrix, which was a direct link to a prefilled checkout page. That part is nice.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by H8crilA on Friday August 09, 2019 @11:42PM (#20659999)
Also speed, it is much faster. But it has all started with the purchase of the main route planning software (ITA), essentially a purchase of a monopoly.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by the_reformation on Saturday August 10, 2019 @12:29AM (#20660165)
The UI is so smooth that I visit almost daily and just punch in cities to see what itineraries come up. I just moved to New York and I'm having a blast seeing all the new nonstop destinations I have.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by tinyhouse on Friday August 09, 2019 @11:39PM (#20659988)
I actually find Google Flights pretty confusing. Haven't tried it recently though. Kayak works pretty well for me and I usually go to the airline's website to book directly when I find a good deal. If the price is the same I book via the airline website. For domestic flights I also check southwest.com since they don't work with Kayak and other travel sites.

Don't be surprised that many other travel sites cannot compete. After all, most of the sites are owned by either Expedia or Priceline. They are not startups. Also, they focus more on hotels since that's where the money is.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by listenallyall on Saturday August 10, 2019 @12:06AM (#20660085)
...and Google's hotel search is starting to supersede the legacy sites in ease of use and speed, just like Flights has.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by HashThis on Saturday August 10, 2019 @10:10AM (#20662133)
Google Flights is amazing, because... Expedia bought up everything else. (Kayak, Orbitz, TripAdvisor, etc.) I've had Expedia do horrible things to me so I'm dedicated to use an alternative. It is needed to have Google Flights be a great competitor.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by dbsmith83 on Saturday August 10, 2019 @10:45AM (#20662329)
Expedia does not own Kayak or TripAdvisor. There is actually a lot of competition in the space. Last thing anyone needs is Google or Amazon stepping into yet another market.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by krn on Saturday August 10, 2019 @07:59PM (#20665304)
> There is actually a lot of competition in the space.

Is there?

Expedia Group owns: Expedia, Ebookers, Orbitz, and Travelocity.

Booking Holdings owns: Priceline, Agoda, Kayak, Momondo, and Cheapflights.

Ctrip Group owns: Trip.com, and SkyScanner.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by sytelus on Friday August 09, 2019 @11:42PM (#20659997)
One of the good test case for any flight booking website is Bhutan. Kayak seems to do good job while G Flights says nothing available. Also later doesn’t seem to allow flexible dates, a critical feature if you ask me.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by devIO on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:13PM (#20658621)
I used to think it was great but it’s no different than an Expedia, which is what my wife uses.

Earlier this week Google had fewer flights than Expedia.

Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by s_y_n_t_a_x on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:48PM (#20658827)
Ditto. GFlights is the best flight planner, especially if you're flexible and want the cheapest day to fly in/out.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by scrollaway on Friday August 09, 2019 @06:49PM (#20658839)
I love Google Flights as well, though I wish they had something like Kayak Trips. My understanding is they kind of do have that with automatic flight booking scanning in gmail, but it's impossible to add information manually in there. A lot of stuff is missing for me at least.
Re:Google to Offer a Best Price Guarantee on Certain Flights by gomox on Friday August 09, 2019 @08:01PM (#20659231)
I routinely find both better routes and prices using Kayak, and it has far more powerful filtering. Mostly intercontinental flights though. I wouldn't be surprised if Google is better tuned to US domestic flights.