News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by amluto on Monday May 20, 2019 @09:57AM (#19960341)
I frequently think that the China is not actually the bad guy here. To me, tech transfer sounds like a good business practice. If I were going to spend billions of dollars buying something, I would seriously consider demanding the IP and know-how to make more of it myself in the future. That way I would have some assurance that my purchase wouldn’t become unsupported and this worthless and that I won’t get price-gauged once I’m locked in. Cough, Oracle, cough. And having one’s major purchases translate to economic growth seems entirely reasonable.

It seems to me that people mostly have problems with tech transfer because it appears to be the government mandating it. Maybe the right solution is for everyone else to start doing tech transfer, too.

Tech transfer to a limited extent for drugs in particular sound like a pretty good idea.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by cameldrv on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:40AM (#19961534)
Of course technology transfer is good for the transferee. I would like a pony too.

What the article is talking about is the forced joint-ventures. Do you want to open up a factory to make your product in China? In many industries, that is not legal. You have to find a Chinese partner to do a joint venture with. You can't just pick any company to do the joint venture with either. Practically it needs to be one that has politically connected owners, so that you don't have endless problems with permits and inspections.

Even though the law states that technology transfer is not a condition of the JV, any politically connected JV partner is going to do what politicians ask of them, which is demand technology transfer. Therefore to do business in China, you're forced to transfer your tech.

Meanwhile in the U.S. if you want to start a business, you fire up Stripe Atlas and you're done in ten minutes.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by tracer4201 on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:50AM (#19961659)
Why is forcing a joint venture a bad deal? Isn’t that choice? You don’t have to do business in China.

Some of my friends that are the most angry about this topic, will on the other hand, defend American companies who pay low wages saying no one is forcing the workers to take those low paying jobs.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by cameldrv on Monday May 20, 2019 @12:07PM (#19961848)
Why is putting tariffs on imported Chinese goods a bad deal? Isn't that a choice? You don't have to sell your products in the U.S.

Fine, China is a Sovereign country and can do what it wishes, but so is the U.S.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by tracer4201 on Monday May 20, 2019 @06:18PM (#19965864)
Was that meant to counter my argument? If so, you’re arguing a straw man. :)
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by SpicyLemonZest on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:59AM (#19961757)
The problem is that China insists they don't do forced technology transfers, and gets angry themselves when e.g. the US cuts off Huawei. If the government openly said "you can't do business in China if you don't want to give us your tech", I don't think anyone would get angry about that, but it would put them in a substantially worse market position than they currently enjoy.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by A2017U1 on Monday May 20, 2019 @12:33PM (#19962145)
But you can't do business in China without handing over your tech and partnering with locals.

Needing that translated, stamped and signed on fancy paper is irrelevant. The message is loud and clear to anyone wanting to do business.

Sovereign nations are allowed to make laws. They are under no obligation to make things easier for foreign multinationals.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by SpicyLemonZest on Monday May 20, 2019 @01:11PM (#19962555)
Having things stamped and signed on fancy paper is absolutely relevant. As the article describes, not having that fancy paper enables the government to brazenly lie, saying forced tech transfers are being stopped when they're actually being ramped up.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by godzillabrennus on Monday May 20, 2019 @09:58AM (#19960353)
It removes much of the incentive to build new tech if you have to turn it over and let someone steal it.

I wouldn’t go into China with any proprietary tech as a foreigner.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by jimbob45 on Monday May 20, 2019 @10:47AM (#19960837)
There's a happy middle ground here. Patents expire after 20 years and that's a form of tech transfer. Maybe China's 1 year is too short and the US' 20 years is too long?
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by SpicyLemonZest on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:49AM (#19961642)
I don't understand the parallel being drawn. The US doesn't require you to file for a patent if you'd rather keep your technology secret.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by quotz on Monday May 20, 2019 @10:02AM (#19960401)
EU and US should form a committee or even a court regarding China IP theft and should pursue act on this with full fury
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by mrep on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:25AM (#19961325)
Or we should just tell China that if huawei wants to sell their 5g tech over here, they need to force tech transfer the 5g tech over to us to do so.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by wil421 on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:32AM (#19961428)
No you can’t do that. The US and EU do not agree with this type of governance. It would set a bad precedence.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by quotz on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:48AM (#19961633)
Well, they should put tariffs and sanctions, sounds quite reasonable. EU and US is the only economic factor in the world after all. Whos gonna China sell to after that? Africa? Russia? :D
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by z2 on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:55AM (#19961722)
Not sure if that was sarcasm, but surely there's South America, South and Southeast Asia, and Australia. Though, obviously not all these places are on good terms with China either.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by Canada on Monday May 20, 2019 @03:33PM (#19964150)
Forget politics, let's just see how well Huawei's Androids sell outside without Play infrastructure. My bet that people will only choose China's consumer software offerings is if they have absolutely no choice.
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by mindslight on Monday May 20, 2019 @12:00PM (#19961781)
Given that having the source code to a system is a necessary part of modern security practice, it would actually be a very good precedent.

This assumption that it's alright for communications infrastructure to rely on trusting black boxes as long as those black boxes were designed by "allied" companies is madness. It doesn't particularly matter whether the gear is made by Qualcomm, Cisco, or Huawei - it's all suspect.

The ultimate path forward is for mobile nodes to stop trusting the network, entirely. But that's a long row to hoe with regards to access authorization without leaking identifiers.

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by wil421 on Monday May 20, 2019 @05:22PM (#19965348)
Who is competent enough to review code? The governments? The crappy companies who the government would inevitably out source it to?
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by mindslight on Monday May 20, 2019 @06:13PM (#19965823)
Anyone is better than no one...
Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by mistermann on Monday May 20, 2019 @12:21PM (#19962000)
> I wouldn’t go into China with any proprietary tech as a foreigner.

How about if you didn't own the company outright but were only a senior executive, and your pay was directly linked to YOY profit increases, ignoring the risk of having that technology stolen and used against you 5-10 years down the road?

Re:Forced Tech Transfers Are on the Rise in China, European ... by ptah on Monday May 20, 2019 @11:30AM (#19961395)
yes it makes sense for countries to do this to avoid getting raided by foreign companies that have them over a barrel