India has amazing "private" hospitals if you compare the doctors and the equipment they use.
India also has the worst "private" hospitals if you compare the hospital support staff specially nurses. Most of them (not all) nurses have no passion and the profession itself is not given the kind of importance that it is given in the US.
Also, the public hospitals in India are a joke. They are terrible. Although some of the best doctors in India come from there. I guess, after seeing more patients than you can handle and having a free hand to do pretty much whatever the heck you want with zero liability (unfortunately and sadly at the cost of the poorest of the poor) they become good.
In most cities in India the private hospitals have turned into a profit making operation with zero oversight and in most cases governments supporting them in manufacturing patients. I would get a second and third opinion on any expensive procedure that would a doctor would recommend in India.
I made lot of friends who are doctors in India and all of them tell me they get direct cash kickbacks from hospitals and labs for referring patients. This is be highly illegal in the US.
Cleanliness is another major issue in Indian hospitals. Even in the best ones most staff don't follow basic sterilization procedures that are common in the western world.
So all in all its great that the hospitals in India are affordable to a cross section of Indians but they can be better with better government oversight and having well trained and passionate nursing staff which might increase costs.
This is because Nurses don't get paid well, avg pay will be around Rs 15,000/month which is simply not enough in metro cities. Majority of the profits of private hospitals goes towards Doctors and hospital administration. Nurses pay have been stagnant for so long. Nurses don't even get extra pay or shift allowance for working nights. Many of the skilled ones, migrate to western countries rather than stay and work in India. Nurses do get paid well in govt hospitals, but govt hospitals are so few as compared to privately run hospitals.
I try to impress on the hospital management during my interactions with them that nurses in some ways are the most important staff in a hospital. They interact with the patient the most and they have the most knowledge of the situation than even the doctor in some situations. Hospitals in the west seem to get this but in India they don't. Most of the focus is on the doctors and equipment. Hopefully this should change in the future.
How can they be terrible and have the best doctors at the same time ?
> Cleanliness is another major issue in Indian hospitals. Even in the best ones most staff don't follow basic sterilization procedures that are common in the western world.
You mentioned before that some private hospitals are amazing, yet here you mention that cleanliness is an issue in indian hospitals. How can they be amazing if cleanliness is an issue ?
> So all in all its great that the hospitals in India are affordable to a cross section of Indians but they can be better with better government oversight and having well trained and passionate nursing staff which might increase costs.
Are you saying that all the nurses in the US come all 'passionate' ?
If I'm understanding correctly, public doctors are in a good position to get experience in dificult cases and learn from worst cases before to jump to private hospitals
I have a problem with the idea of "passionate nurses".
Nurses shouldn't be "passionate", they have to be professional. Passionate people, unable to emotionally detach, will burn quickly in such place like an hospital (where the supply of suffering people is endless, and they can't decide and bassically obey orders from the upper staff). This has lead in the past to compassionate serial killers. Death angels have always the best intentions drawn in their head. Trying to be the mother and best friend of each one of your patients is a terrible strategy at long term.
When I look at what surgeons actually do, it seems clear to me that more than anything else they need lots of practice. Life isn't very fair, so I'm guessing most of the practice happens to poor patients and most of the competence happens to rich patients.
A friend of mine is a nurse who did social work in rural India. What she told me about the local hospitals was horrifying, not just the condition of the hospital and how patients with infectious diseases were sleeping on the corridors because of lack of beds, but how the doctors had a total disinterest (bordering on contempt) of the uneducated woman who she went to appointments with.
It’s hard to generalise anything about India which is incredibly huge and diverse.
Just as Black or Native American would be a poor substitute for poor american.
Or Roma/Eskimo/Greenlander/Sami for Europe
Especially considering that the current prime minister and president of India are from so called backward communities.
India has come a long way in social development and using the "caste card" is quite out of taste.
The word "Caste" is of European origin and does not have a proper native equivalent.
The "caste system" itself is again a European concept imported into India to aid the colonial powers in their divide and rule.
Unlike the persecution of the Native Americans, Blacks, Jews or Aboriginal which were systematic state run pogroms often in democracies.
The fate of the "low caste" can be attributed to the fact that they were the most exploited, often to the point of death or slavery under colonial rule. While the so called "Upper caste" enjoyed second rung positions as peons, clerks and teachers. This experience is universal in the other colonies like Rwanda, Syria or Iraq where the words "Tribes" or "Clans" have come to substitute "Caste".
It must be noted that the newly independent India gave all Indians of both sexes the right to vote and went on further to provide "reservations" the equivalent of "affirmative action". This was long before the black American even got the right to vote. Less said about Europe the better, the "Roma" still get rounded up and "deported" even though as EU citizens they have the right to mobility.
"Caste" is a powerful tool for the unscrupulous politician inside India. The excuse of colonial apologists or more markedly the evangelists (if they are not the former) outside India.
Caste a European concept so prominent in the family names of Americans and Europeans, has today become synonymous with India thanks to the relentless propaganda of the colonialists/evangelists.
Giving example of the Prime Minister/President is equivalent to saying since Barack Obama is the president of US, black discrimination.
PS: I belong to the so called Lower Caste in India and I have myself experienced instances of subtle/blatant discrimination. Thankfully haven't experienced anything serious yet, maybe because I became an Software Engineer and now live in a major city, thanks to the affirmative actions adopted by India, but poorer strata of lower caste living in tier-3 cities/villages face a lot of cases of discrimination even today.
While India has a long way in social development, it still has a long to go. This narrative of bashing Europeans/Outsiders/Pakistanis for anything negative has to stop. Jati System has been in practise for thousands of years now.
You mean from reservations in school / university admissions? Or does that even extend to private employment? Is there widespread resentment?
I'm really curious about the parallels (or not) between racism in the US and caste in India, esp. affirmative action. The US never really went all-in on AA like India did with reservations -- more like pretending if we mostly ignore race then racism will go away -- but it seems like neither approach has really gotten to good place (yet).
> In this episode, I had a conversation with a middle-class Dalit who lives in Gujarat. For me, Dalits are people who are reported on, written on, people who I hear about spoken of (usually sympathetically). But I wanted to talk to a Dalit who was a university educated middle-class person, to zero in on the essential aspect of being SC in India today. At least urban India.
> One interesting observation is that his own experience in India is filled with slights, but not day to day oppression. It doesn’t seem the lot of Dalits in urban India is anything like that of black Americans during Jim Crow. He seemed to assume that America had solved much of its race problem and that that’s what Dalits should aspire to. Curiously, Americans at this point, at least on the Left, perceive our racial problems as dire.
https://www.brownpundits.com/2019/03/06/browncast-podcast-ep...
Podcast links https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/brown-pundits/id14390070...
http://brownpundits.libsyn.com/the-life-and-views-of-a-middl...
https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/razib-khan/brown-pundits-po...
https://player.fm/series/brown-pundits/the-life-and-views-of...
I’m in US, race is the thing here and it’s fairly identifiable.
You can check out a wikipedia page which can be used to map it - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Indian_family_names
Apart from that, you are required to submit your caste certificate in school in for Board Registration, which is loosely handled, hence process is not anonymous, so now your schoolmates know your caste. In my College, there were many ways to know the caste of the person- like Fee structure is different for SC/STs and Others. The whole list used to be published publicly, and everyone had to refer to it during semester registration. Now everyone who notices your name knows you an SC/ST. There was huge resentment in the General/OBC community regarding the Fee Structure, as they just see that his mate is paying almost 1/10th the fee. I usually didn't reveal my caste to anyone, and my surname is a bit ambiguous so sometime my peers/friends used to rant about it as well.
Now after college, I have lived in around 3 major cities- Mumbai, Delhi and Bangalore. Usually no-one asks about your caste here, but it does happens sometime. People belonging to Higher caste have no issues in revealing it, though people in my/lower communities usually hesitate and do not want to reveal it.
Moving to other city and rebranding yourself as an higher caste might work, but if caught, there can be social severe repercussion. Caste hierarchy is actually flexible and dependent on the social position of the caste in that specific area. So you would also find cases, where X is a higher than Y in some places.
Arranged Marriages in India are most mostly caste based as well.
People also associate caste with IQs as people of lower caste using reservation didn't had to score much in their entrance exams, hence usually I avoid the topic all together if possible. There are other traits as well that people assume.
Now not everyone would discriminate against you, its almost like not every white guy is racist in US, but you would very much like to just avoid interacting with the ones who are. But I would still say an inherent Bias is still present.
In short, answer to your question- yes rebranding yourself is possible, though its not very simple. There is even a term for it in sociology named Sanskritisation. There is also Brahminisation, which is when a group adopts social traits of Brahmins who sit at the top of the caste system.
I'm really not familiar with the tribe/clan system in Iraq and Syria. My experience in some other former british and french colonies made it clear how the colonial system benefited from or even created and promoted ethnic rivalries, racism, tribalism -- yes absolutely -- but none of those situations seemed to really be a direct analogue of India's caste system. Do most people in India think of caste pretty much the same way as Americans think of ethnicity or racism?
Maybe you can also talk a bit more about Modi and his "low caste" background, because I've been curious about this myself. How much do you make of his "caste" as part his political identity? Do you see this as a sign that the caste system is dead/irrelevant/never-existed? Or that the low castes have triumphed? Or is he a pawn/token in a bigger game?
If India was the only country where "caste" is a phenomenon, at least we should have a native name for it. People often claim Varna to be the equivalent, but you almost never hear the word "Varna" being used.
The reason is "William Jones", who synthesized the Indian caste system by selectively digging deep into the scriptures.
Caste today is essentially an economic mobility problem and should have a quick death. But by constantly casting it as a social problem people make sure it is kept alive.
The main beneficiaries are 1. Politicians 2. Evangelists 3. Otherwise wealthy Indians who have managed to carve out a quota from the reservation system meant to benefit the backward communities. 4. Used as a stick by the west 5. Naxal and sociologists
Modi unlike Obama isn't a one show man. Nor is he just the face of the party. He has won again and again, and continues to have huge public support. Goes to prove ones caste isn't important to the public.
Caste is also extremely regional, the names are meaningless outside. In the state that I come from TN, the vast majority of the people have gotten rid of the their family names for the last 2-3 generations for the sake of social equality, yet have a 70% reservation.
Understandably JATTI (rather than caste) is significant among the poor because it is their primary social security. So fishermen, metal workers, farmers, weavers etc form a strong community within their profession.
Like a lab rat that has been deliberately infected and the conditions made worse so it can be studied. The "caste system" that should have a natural death, continues to live on thanks to our heros.
She ended up having emergency spine surgery. Fused L5-S1 vertebrae and replaced disk in between.
FWIW, I'm relatively well off and have medical insurance, but the cost is absolutely negligible compared to what I hear is prevalent in the US - about $10 / month.
It's probably just my bad luck, but I've had three surgeries in the last 10 years - an appendectomy, an ACL replacement, and a septoplasty. Each one of these was done in highly regarded (and expensive) hospitals in Delhi - Apollo, Max, and Fortis. Each time I walked out of the hospital without paying a single dime. I just had to show my insurance card, and the entire stay was cashless. In fact, after my last surgery I realised that I could have even been reimbursed for my medication post surgery if I'd kept the receipts (which I unfortunately didn't).
Anyhow, more power to Narayana.