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Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by niftich on Thursday March 14, 2019 @04:46PM (#19393516)
India has an intricate history with nuclear technology. Both the Soviet Union and the US courted India in the 1950s, but in the end it was Canada who donated a design for the first Indian reactor that came online in the 1960s. The US assisted with building another. Indian testing of nuclear weapons in the 1970s drew a sharp rebuke from several countries and the US and Canada withdrew their assistance. This also resulted in the creation of the Nuclear Suppliers Group, an export control regime to prevent nuclear proliferation. Cut off from exporters of nuclear technology, they slowly continued with domestic designs and new research. But their tremendous size and influence made them an attractive partner in geopolitical power plays.

In 1988 the Soviet Union and India announced they would build two new reactors, and the US fiercely protested at the time. The Soviet Union fell apart, and the Russians didn't resume the project for another 10 years, but construction eventually began in 2002. In 2006 the US and India reached an agreement to cooperate and the US lobbied for an exemption for India from the Nuclear Suppliers Group, which was granted. It quickly became obvious that everyone wanted a slice of the Indian nuclear energy market.

Disregarding climate change for a moment, it's clear that the energy demand in India is increasing, and despite a rapid rise in the deployment of renewables, utility-scale generation is still 75% coal. This contributes greatly to pollution. Local coal lower quality than elsewhere, requiring more per unit of power. Nuclear will be an important complement to renewables as the energy mix slowly migrates off of coal. Unlike the US, which is awash in cheap natural gas that's readily stored and piped where needed, helping to even out the mismatch between solar generation and demand, India has very little natural gas, so it can't afford to pursue a strategy that deemphasizes nuclear energy.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by ergothus on Thursday March 14, 2019 @05:49PM (#19394162)
Missing from that history was India developing nuclear weapons in the late 90s - I imagine that changed the politics immensely.

Today they are an even more important and influential geopolitical ally, and the pollution argument you raise is as important as you say, but the concerns about a power supplying them with nuclear weapons ala the alleged Israel/US history is no longer a part of it (I assume).

...then again, I could be completely wrong in any of this. Comments welcome.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by rfinney on Thursday March 14, 2019 @07:24PM (#19394931)
India started developing nuclear weapons in the 1950s and first tested a nuclear bomb in 1974.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by femto on Thursday March 14, 2019 @06:07PM (#19394327)
One concern is nuclear material being diverted from their civilian programs to weapons programs. As a major suppler of uranium, this has been an issue in Australia for the last decade. India wants Australian uranium, but they aren't a party to the non-proliferation treaty. It seems that the $ won out though, as Australia is now shipping uranium to India.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-19/australia-quietly-mak...

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by pushtheenvelope on Thursday March 14, 2019 @07:24PM (#19394932)
it's worth understanding why India doesn't sign the non-proliferation treaty.

The treaty essentially states that only 5 countries (US, UK, France, China, Russia) can have nuclear weapons. India says this is discriminatory: either all countries denuclearize or other countries can develop nuclear weapons.

afaik india has a good record of preserving its nuclear secrets, and not doing "proliferation" to other countries.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by krtkush on Friday March 15, 2019 @02:12AM (#19397001)
Plus, India has a no first use policy. So it's not like India will threaten other countries with nuclear consequences in case of war like situations. This makes India's approach to nuclear weapons safer, IMO.

Of course, such policies can be changed whenever India would want to.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by godelski on Thursday March 14, 2019 @10:55PM (#19396038)
It is also worth noting that there's a big difference in enrichment plants for power plants vs enrichment plants for weapons grade material (this was a big part of the Iran deal). That being said, it isn't like you can't make a weapon out from the power grade enrichment plants, but it is substantially harder. It is even harder if you're being watched (by say... the US or Russia).
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by lmm on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:17AM (#19398275)
> The treaty essentially states that only 5 countries (US, UK, France, China, Russia) can have nuclear weapons. India says this is discriminatory: either all countries denuclearize or other countries can develop nuclear weapons.

Part of the treaty is that those 5 are supposed to (gradually) denuclearise, and also to assist with civilian power efforts.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by rainhacker on Friday March 15, 2019 @01:42PM (#19402145)
> Part of the treaty is that those 5 are supposed to (gradually) denuclearise

and how is that going for the big players since the treaty was singed ?

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by lmm on Monday March 18, 2019 @07:59AM (#19420355)
Nuclear arsenals are a fraction of their former size, and "battlefield" nuclear weapons have been almost entirely eliminated. But no-one has signed up to take the final step down to zero.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by pushtheenvelope on Monday March 18, 2019 @02:51PM (#19423936)
yeah, agree with you on arsenal sizes going down.

As much as I would like nuclear weapons gone, I don't see it as being done to a satisfactory level that assuages India's concerns. I don't think anyone has made a real commitment to denuclearizing, akin to what South Africa did a while ago.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by writepub on Friday March 15, 2019 @04:22AM (#19397702)
Like other comments have noted, it's almost taken for granted that 5 countries can dictate who does and doesn't get access to uranium. It's fine that they collude, but legitimizing their collusion as logical or moral isn't really convincing. Discrimination isn't logical, especially when the club includes Russia and China - countries famous for being overtly belligerent, with a horrible human rights track record
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by chopin on Friday March 15, 2019 @05:51AM (#19398142)
In what way is China overtly belligerent compared to, say, the US?
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by adventured on Friday March 15, 2019 @09:41AM (#19399575)
What was the last territory that the US annexed? What territory has it formally annexed as the dominant superpower for the last 70 years? Hawaii is about it, with the US controlling Hawaii since the 19th century.

China just recently used its military to annex territory the size of India. The largest territory grab since Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia were piling up conquests. That's after annexing Tibet (larger than Colombia) immediately after WW2. Next they plan to annex the world's 21st largest economy and one of the largest economies in Asia in Taiwan. Most of China's neighbors are openly terrified of it, including South Korea, Japan, Vietnam, Taiwan and the Philippines.

Meanwhile the US has maintained stable, massive borders with Canada and Mexico for a very long time, despite being comically more powerful in every regard. The US isn't attempting to annex the Gulf of Mexico away from Mexico & Co., even though it trivially could and nobody could stop it. Neither Canada nor Mexico are actually afraid of the US.

Canada's border with the US has been the largest, longest non-militarized border in world history. India, South Korea, Taiwan and Vietnam (arguably Russia as well) are in perpetual military stand-off mode on their territory and borders with China.

Dozens of countries allow the US to station its superpower military inside their borders, with zero fear of being annexed or invaded for conquest. Japan, Germany, Poland, South Korea, the Baltics, et al. are not afraid the US is suddenly going to decide to try to annex them or their territory.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by chopin on Friday March 15, 2019 @10:58AM (#19400257)
Annexation and being belligerent are two different things. You can be the latter without doing the former. In that regard the US hasn't a stellar track record.

>China just recently used its military to annex territory the size of India

I am not sure what you are talking about.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by wcarron on Friday March 15, 2019 @02:41PM (#19402831)
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by tracker1 on Monday March 18, 2019 @12:44PM (#19422683)
Depends on if you are China or the population being annexed.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by pjc50 on Thursday March 14, 2019 @06:30PM (#19394515)
Let's not overlook the recent skirmish with adjacent nuclear power, Pakistan.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by writepub on Thursday March 14, 2019 @09:20PM (#19395601)
Maybe citations would help, but language like "Canada donated a design" simply makes no sense geopolitically. No country "donates" nuclear tech
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by niftich on Thursday March 14, 2019 @10:26PM (#19395901)
[1] Canada blamed for India's 'peaceful' bomb [Radio broadcast]. (1974, May 20). In As It Happens. Ottawa, Ontario: Canadian Broadcasting Corporation. Retrieved March 14, 2019, from https://www.cbc.ca/archives/entry/1974-canada-blamed-for-ind...

[2] Perkovich, G. (2001). India's nuclear bomb: The impact on global proliferation. Berkeley, CA: University of California Press. <https://books.google.com/books?id=UDA9dUryS8EC>

[3] Ramana, M V (2012). The Power of Promise: Examining Nuclear Energy in India. Penguin Books Limited. <https://books.google.com/books?id=5m8Atq0ncrwC>

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by writepub on Friday March 15, 2019 @03:45AM (#19397494)
Quoting your CBC citation:

"The nuclear device was built using plutonium obtained from the 40-megawatt Cirus research reactor, a gift from Canada"

Plutonium, the raw material (also) used for making bombs, was "donated". And apparently a working "research" reactor. A bomb design was certainly not donated, nor is it evident that Canada intended to transfer nuclear tech intellectual property, all the article claims was Canada's intent to sell working reactors and fuel, not designs, to India. FYI - Canada wouldn't have wanted India to have nuclear IP, for fear of cannibalising it's nuclear revenue stream of fuel and reactors to India!!

Just the be clear, 31 countries have working nuclear power reactors, while only 7 have bombs. Unless you intend to undermine India's indigenous nuclear capabilities, all this hand waving about Canada "donating" designs doesn't hold up. After all, we're talking about the most lethal of weapons here, not candies that are casually "donated". Western intelligence agencies have a storied history of preventing nuclearization. India got nuclear despite the West, not because of

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by anomaly_ on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:50AM (#19398448)
I think OP is suggesting that Canada donated the reactor design, not a blueprint for a nuclear bomb.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by coldacid on Friday March 15, 2019 @09:27AM (#19399471)
Yep. Hell, as far as I know, we've never even designed a nuclear bomb, and the only nukes on Canadian soil were American built and controlled, and gone as soon as they were no longer needed up here.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by writepub on Friday March 15, 2019 @11:20AM (#19400470)
But the suggestion is inaccurate, based on the OP's own citation. Reactor design IP is a closely guarded secret, heavily regulated and controlled to prevent nuclearization of other countries.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by pankajdoharey on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:17AM (#19398271)
India used the low enriched Uranium fuel reactor donated by Canada to breed plutonium and make nuclear bombs in 70's. Before that nobody thought it were possible to make nuclear weapons with low enriched uranium reactor to breed plutonium. Nonetheless India is a mature nuclear power, the world should really be worried about is pakistan as a nuclear state.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by richjdsmith on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:23AM (#19398298)
Every single time I remember that Pakistan is a nuclear power, I am a bit worried.

It's certainly in a top 5 position of countries I'd rather not have access to nuclear weapons.

Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by L_226 on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:29AM (#19398335)
Well, in the recent skirmishes it seems that Pakistan was actually the more level headed of the two. India has been agitating about Kashmir due to local elections coming up, and BJP wants to gather the 'tough on Pakistan/national security' votes.
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by quantummkv on Friday March 15, 2019 @02:55PM (#19402970)
Well, that's after you conveniently take away the fact that Pakistan essentially started the latest skirmish. You really can't blame India for responding to the murder of their people on their soil, can you?
Re:US to build six nuclear power plants in India by dalbasal on Friday March 15, 2019 @06:53AM (#19398470)
The difference is (a) government control over the army and (b) the role of paramilitaries... It just means that pakistan has more vectors for escalation. Populist flag thumping is a vestor in both countries.