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Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by ivanbakel on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:11AM (#19294488)
What would be the motivator for this kind of clause? I can't imagine radio-device manufacturers would appreciate the additional expense, and at least some of them must benefit from consumers buying those products specifically for customization.

Are the national governments pushing for more radio control? Is there some kind of crisis of radio abuse? Or is it an indirect way to give governments more punishment tools, by making radio modification a subversion of manufacturer controls, so you can be slapped with an additional charge if you ever use a custom radio device in a crime?

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by tzs on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:35AM (#19294598)
I haven't read the EU proposal, but for the corresponding US rule, the motivation was to reduce interference with other radio users. In many of these products, the radio is capable of frequencies, power levels, and modulation modes that are not legal, and the device relies entirely on the firmware not choosing an illegal combination to stay legal. People have used third party firmware to allow choosing illegal radio settings.

The regulations were written in the US to be compatible with open source and customization, only requiring that outside software not be able to set the radio to transmit outside the legal limits that applied to that type of device.

A router manufacturer does not have to lock down all the firmware to satisfy this. They can make it so that the "set radio parameters" part of the firmware is separate from the rest, with only the former being restricted. This is the approach the FCC encourages, rather than simply locking down the whole thing.

In fact, when TP-Link was making routers that could operate outside legal power levels, and the FCC went after them, the consent decree they agreed to required TP-Link to work with OpenWrt and the radio chipset manufacturers to ensure that they could build compliant routers without locking out third party firmware.

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by xondono on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:24AM (#19294545)
Basically the EU has discovered SDR (Software Defined Radio) and wants to limit its use.

The usual excuses are given, electrical safety, emission on protected bands...

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by presscast on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:31AM (#19294584)
Right, but why would they want to regulate SDR?
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by beamatronic on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:32AM (#19294590)
FUD. Fear, uncertainty, doubt
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by presscast on Sunday March 03, 2019 @04:52PM (#19297169)
That's how. The question is "what problem do they think they're solving"?
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by throw082 on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:49AM (#19294663)
maybe because they can be used for many nefarious purposes?
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by dTal on Sunday March 03, 2019 @10:00AM (#19294719)
So can wheels.

You shouldn't ban general purpose technology because of particular bad uses.

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by ben_w on Sunday March 03, 2019 @10:16AM (#19294800)
“Regulate” != “Ban”

And in this case, the proposed regulation is:

“””[R]adio equipment [shall support] certain features in order to ensure that software can only be loaded into the radio equipment where the compliance of the combination of the radio equipment and software has been demonstrated.”””

Now I don’t think that’s a well written rule, but my problem is the specifics rather than the general idea. I think that either all broadcasts should be digitally signed, or it should not be possible for hackers to remotely modify many other people’s radios to broadcast false signals. (One-on-one modifications I don’t care about so much, but how do you write/pass such rules, given the difficulty getting people to care about or believe the scale difference between automated and manual hacking?)

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by xondono on Sunday March 03, 2019 @10:34AM (#19294891)
The problem is that we already have regulations to avoid broadcasting on restricted/licensed bands.

In general, current regulation makes the owner of the equipment responsible for the broadcast.

This new regulation will just stifle development on SDR technologies

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by the_mitsuhiko on Sunday March 03, 2019 @12:07PM (#19295461)
And the current regulations are impossible to enforce. If they would work we wouldn’t be in this situation.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by gray_-_wolf on Sunday March 03, 2019 @12:37PM (#19295635)
> If they would work we wouldn’t be in this situation.

What situation? What crisis is happening I'm completely missing?

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by Dylan16807 on Sunday March 03, 2019 @01:11PM (#19295828)
> “Regulate” != “Ban”

Imagine how ridiculous it would be to have a regulation on wheels that they must try to prevent being installed on non-approved devices.

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by patrickaljord on Sunday March 03, 2019 @10:09AM (#19294763)
I agree with you, but for anyone following EU rules and regulations, this ship has sailed a long time ago. Drugs, guns, radio are just part of a huge long list of "general purpose technology" that have been regulated out of existence.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by SZJX on Monday March 04, 2019 @04:24AM (#19299904)
That sounds like a hot take. I'm pretty sure most EU residents are very satisfied that they don't have to fea for their safety for gun violence when they walk home late at night or just in general.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by presscast on Monday March 04, 2019 @01:43PM (#19303966)
>don't have to fea for their safety for gun violence when they walk home late at night or just in general.

Neither do "most US residents".

More to the point, your focus on guns is missing the larger point. There is very real and immediate dissatisfaction with the EU regulatory landscape. See: Brexit.

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by the_mitsuhiko on Sunday March 03, 2019 @10:11AM (#19294772)
A lot of general purpose technologies are restricted to safe use.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by Dylan16807 on Sunday March 03, 2019 @02:07PM (#19296172)
Restricting it to safe use is what the preexisting law does.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by presscast on Monday March 04, 2019 @01:41PM (#19303946)
Like what? I'm not being flippant here, I'm really in the dark. What harm can one do with an SDR, and how does the potential for abuse compare to e.g. a cell phone?
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by ethbro on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:19AM (#19294525)
The availability of easily-hackable, low-cost Chinese hardware?

I'm not as familiar with EU law, but similar changes in the US were prompted by "Import hardware configured legally, but manufacturer winks / doesn't care about flashes to illegal specifications" scenarios (indeed, it may be a way to boost sales).

The correct legislative solution seems to mandate locked RF firmware... while also mandating customer access to tinker with the remainder of functionality.

This addresses the tendency for manufacturers to simply lock down everything as the cheapest path to legal compliance.

TBH, if you want a right to tinker with RF firmware, a ham (or equivalent) license seems a low (probably too low) but necessary and fair burden.

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by IndrekR on Sunday March 03, 2019 @01:09PM (#19295812)
Disclaimer: Automated hardware unit tests and test devices, including RF tests for firmware developers, are bringing bread to my table.

Looking at this rule from another angle, I think the objective is to have a single entity to blame if interfering device is found. In this context this may seem rational -- all the firmware released that is mangling with intentional radiators needs to be tested to prove it is compliant. However, the method creates extra complexity for the device manufacturers and as time has shown -- does not really improve the matters in the long term, you will just get a fleet of devices running old firmware with unfixed bugs. Manufacturers often do not like it either, specially in the management.

I think it may be a classical example of "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" or Hanlon's razor*

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor

Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by swinglock on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:17AM (#19294508)
Allowed frequencies and transmit power varies in the world, so the cheapest way sell to all markets is to set a few different bits in firmware to make it fit for those regulations. That could be a factor.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by gmueckl on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:30AM (#19294573)
This is what this change is about. It follows similar regulations in the US, btw. Smartphones should be mostly fine if the radios are controlled entirely by the baseband. Then changing the main OS cannot have any effect on the compliance of the device.
Re:Protest against the EU radio lockdown by tetha on Sunday March 03, 2019 @09:49AM (#19294667)
Also this feels like an ugly interaction with the right to repair. Old devices will become even harder to update and patch due to legal requirements.