On the other hand, I genuinely do feel theory is really important. While not knowing the minutia of a tim-sort doesn't indicate that you'll be a bad engineer, not knowing the runtime efficiency of a sort can lead to some really awful code. Not knowing when to use a hash table instead of a nested-for loop can be a sign that you don't really know what you're doing, and not knowing some rough theory on concurrency indicates that I might be stuck debugging your race conditions or deadlock.
I try to not be a complete jerk and I won't do stuff like give out an NP-complete problem (which an interviewer gave me once), nor will I ask for intimate details of how one would implement CSP, but I do tend to focus on theory-heavy questions more than my peers, but I try to give a fairly-generous amount of hints so that people don't get too stuck.
Theory is important but what's more important is how someone applies the theory to actual problem solving.
Reversing a binary tree isn't testing your knowledge of theory as much as it's really just testing memorization of a very very specific application. Knowing how to reverse a binary tree or how a hash map works is pointless if the person can't identify when to use them when solving an actual higher level problem. No one is ever given a binary tree and told to reverse it in the real world, they are given a business problem that you identify can be solved efficiently by modelling it as a binary tree and reversing it.
I'd bet most of the good people who fail the "reverse a binary tree" type of questions would succeed if you give them a realistic problem to solve without forcing a very specific solution onto them. Either they will come up to the realization that the solution is to think of the problem in terms of binary tree or they won't.
And neither is a terribly bad answer either. If they recognize you gave them a problem that can be represented as a binary tree and efficiently solved by reversing it then there you go, not only did you prove they knew the "theory" but they knew how to apply it as well. If they don't recognize it you gain valuable insight into their line of thinking and they might find novel ways to represent the problem and apply other theoretical concepts that solve it efficiently (maybe more maybe less).
I learned later that hashmaps are inherently O(n) (or O(log n)), or they take a lot of memory; internal arrays can get super huge if you're not careful.
In this particular case, an ugly nested for-loop was the immediate solution, and eventually I was able to cheat a little and have hard-coded integer indexes and was able to use an array.
Anyway, your point is valid, I just figured I'd give an example where knowing the internals for a hash table would have saved me a lot of time.
OK but why don’t these interviewers ever ask “internals” questions? How does a CPU works, or what the different levels of memory hierarchy are, what an interrupt request is, what is pipelining, what is SIMD, what is a GPU, etc. Or how about compiler internals, what are the different stages in a compilers, what are the different grammars and parsers, what is an AST, what is interpretation, compilation, bytecode, JIT, and how does it work? How about database internals? How is a database implemented, what is relational algebra, what is normalization, what is a data model, how do indices work? Similar questions can be asked about operating system internals, networking, floating point arithmetic, etc. In my experience, no interviewer has ever asked me these questions. And as an interviewer, I have consistently been disappointed with candidates’ inability to answer basic and relevant “internals” questions. Ironically, the algorithms and data structures questions that are commonly asked in interviews are outdated ways of thinking which do not take the underlying hardware reality into account (memory hierarchy and parallelism). It could be because a lot of these FANG(-like) “engineers” are themselves not knowledgeable to ask such questions. Or they are aware that new comp sci graduates are unlikely to really understand anything at a deep level, but all comp sci students are drilled on algorithms and data structures. If you are targeting a very specific age group (0-5 years experience) and want a standardized test then I guess asking CS201 exam questions in a job interview make sense. Companies prefer the 0-5yrs experience segment because they’re cheap, don’t have children, are easy to exploit, and they are easier to “mold” into your corporate culture.
Because not everyone writing Java code has had a background that exposes them to compiler internals or grammars and parsers.
But everyone writing Java code should at least be a little bit arsed to figure out what common data structures do - or how to write two for loops that print out "1 2 fizz 4 buzz"...
If I were hiring a carpenter I would want to know they understand their tools and when to use them. I don't care if they don't know how to make them. But of course knowing how to make them suggests an intimate appreciation for the craft (looking your way Matthias Wandel)
My beef with this in interviewing is that a huge chunk of modern programming work is developing UIs - and user interface theory and skills are treated like some softball thing. You ask UI-related questions to interviewers and half the time you get some shrug "oh we use whatever", etc.
I can't say that theory is more universal than frontend, though anecdotally, for me, it is. But ui isn't universal.
On the flip side, the O(1) look-up nature of hash tables make them the no-brainer data structure to use, at least for passing programming interviews. Perhaps more interesting test questions would be when not to use hash tables.
Although these days one should talk about "learned index structures" instead, I guess :)
That sort of thing might give a better sense of if someone has an instinct for how to verify whether the code is working. And, by extension, if they have a grasp of some concepts that go a long way toward helping a person come up with more reliable and maintainable designs.
How do you know?
I understand that FANG have themselves come to the conclusion that brain teasers are not necessarily very predictive for engineering performance.
But CS/programming questions for CS/programming roles? That seems sensible.
You can study lots of vocabulary to achieve better results on the verbal section of the GRE or similar tests. But afterwards, you will, in fact, have better vocabulary, I submit.
I am surprised that you categorically deny that they were better engineers after studying CS/programming questions.
Yeah, but tests like the GRE claim to predict academic performance, not vocabulary. So unless you think augmenting one's vocabulary alone will make one a substantially better student, there's still a gap there.
Maybe for a few days after the test anyways. And then...you push out those words you never use or read to make room for actual useful stuff.
There’s interview cake and leetcode, but I think people would pay $2k for a class that focuses on the questions and in person whiteboard practice.
They could collect information about the interviews at the major companies and then use those to create the program. For payment could also help candidates negotiate and then take a cut of the signing bonus.
If this isn’t part of lambda school already I think it should be.
I already work at a competitive tech company, but I’d sign up for this in a second to help me stay competitive for interviews.
It’s part of classes for our existing students, but it isn’t a single offering. One day.
It's funny that after doing some searching, many proponents of this widely adopted and poorly researched interviewing methodology appear to be running businesses selling training for these interview processes... surprise, surprise.
Ultimately, its just studying for the test, very much like the ACT/SAT in high school. You can be great at taking tests but ultimately a terrible student or vice versa.