Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by nathan_f77 on Friday February 08, 2019 @04:17PM
(#19118768)
For this equation:
n/d = n * (2^N/d) / (2^N)
What is "N"? They didn't seem to explain that, although they say "Yet for N large enough", and "drop the least significant N bits". Is it just a very large integer? Or maybe the maximum integer for a certain number of bytes?
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by nkurz on Friday February 08, 2019 @04:33PM
(#19118908)
The Wikipedia article seems to be using slightly different definitions. For the blog post, the actual article gives better definitions: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1902.01961.pdf.
I'm one of the co-authors, and I believe that in our case, N is always equal to the maximum bitwidth of the numerator. So for a 32-bit integer, N=32. I'll see if Daniel can add some clarification to the blog post.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by dlemire on Friday February 08, 2019 @04:54PM
(#19119055)
(I am the author of the blog post and I am answering here at the request of nkurz.)
So nkurz is correct that, in the paper, N is always equal to the maximum bitwidth of the numerator. I was not careful enough to make sure that the notation of the paper matches the notation of the blog post. So the N from the blog post is the F from the paper. I am sorry about this.
I added the following footnote.
"What is N? If both the numerator n and the divisor d are 32-bit unsigned integers, then you can pick N=64. This is not the smallest possible value. The smallest possible value is given by Algorithm 2 in our paper and it involves a bit of mathematics (note: the notation in my blog post differs from the paper, N becomes F)."
To make it super simple, if you have 32-bit values, then pick N (from the blog post) to be 64 and you are all set. You can do better, but this requires knowing what the divisor is.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by mark-r on Friday February 08, 2019 @06:56PM
(#19119747)
I recently discovered that x/10 == (x*103)>>10 for the numbers 0-99. Helped speed up something I was working on. The compiler generated a similar multiply/shift for x/10, but mine was faster since it didn't need to work for all possible values of x.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by nitrogen on Friday February 08, 2019 @11:16PM
(#19120691)
This is called reciprocal multiplication. You can trade off accuracy for number of bits required, etc. I used this to do meaningful processing of Kinect data on a CPU without an FPU at near full frame rate.
Just curious, did you try making x an 8-bit integer to see if the compiler chose a different multiplier?
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by mark-r on Friday February 08, 2019 @11:33PM
(#19120746)
For modern processors you can assume that a couple of instructions will be much faster than a memory lookup. Even if the lookup is cached it will most likely push something else important out of cache.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by mark-r on Friday February 08, 2019 @11:27PM
(#19120726)
My code was two instructions: imul eax,ecx,67h sar eax,0Ah. The compiler generated code was mov eax,66666667h imul ecx sar edx,2 mov eax,edx shr eax,1Fh add eax,edx.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by saagarjha on Saturday February 09, 2019 @04:13AM
(#19121461)
This was exactly what I was about to mention; I can reproduce your results in Clang but it seems GCC doesn't want to optimize this? Here's what Godbolt gives me: https://godbolt.org/z/aFTdur
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by remcob on Friday February 08, 2019 @11:24PM
(#19120718)
This is very similar to Montgomery reduction [1]. Both do a multiply taking low bits followed by a multiply taking the high bits to reduce a number.
Montgomery reduction requires an augmented number system with conversions to and from. The article's approach works on numbers directly, but if I understand it correctly the multiplications are twice the width.
Are these two methods algebraically related? Would it be possible to get fastmod working without the double width?
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by yorwba on Friday February 08, 2019 @05:21PM
(#19119236)
The article mentions the book and that the method presented therein is used by clang for faster division. The novel part is to adapt the method for faster remainders without calculating the quotient first.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by kbenson on Friday February 08, 2019 @05:19PM
(#19119224)
As noted by the article in question:
The idea is not novel and goes back to at least 1973 (Jacobsohn). However, engineering matters because computer registers have finite number of bits, and multiplications can overflow. I believe that, historically, this was first introduced into a major compiler (the GNU GCC compiler) by Granlund and Montgomery (1994). While GNU GCC and the Go compiler still rely on the approach developed by Granlund and Montgomery, other compilers like LLVM’s clang use a slightly improved version described by Warren in his book Hacker’s Delight.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by bonzini on Friday February 08, 2019 @05:32PM
(#19119318)
The second edition of Hacker's Delight does have a section on "Testing for zero reminders after division by a constant", but it uses the multiplicative inverse.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by vanderZwan on Saturday February 09, 2019 @02:35AM
(#19121208)
I wouldn't be surprised if some people had already thought of it while coming up with a fast quotient method, but didn't bother to do anything with it because they did not need a remainder.
Re:Faster remainders when the divisor is a constant: beating...
by bloomer on Friday February 08, 2019 @07:27PM
(#19119870)
Yes, the paper is general and covers the case for arbitrary bit size. 64-bit would require a 128-bit approximate inverse in general and the multiplication during computing the mod would extend that out another 64-bits. So would require three registers and two more multiplications on x64 I think. Socidont think it gains you anything in the general case. Bit for some divisors it might beat the traditional Granlund-Montgomery-Warren method when you could use a smaller approximate inverse.
EDIT: I'm reading this Wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_algorithm#Division_by...
For a 32-bit unsigned integer, you would use N = 33 when dividing by 3? And N = 35 when dividing by 10? I'm struggling to see how this works.
EDIT 2: I think this post helped me understand it: https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/114807/fast-faster-fa...
"The·basic idea is to approximate the ratio (1/constant) by another rational number (numerator/denominator) with a power of two as the denominator."
Their example:
Maps to the original example: 2^11 / 10 = 2048 / 10 = 204.8, which rounds to 205.So N would be 11 in this example, but I guess it could be any value.
I'm one of the co-authors, and I believe that in our case, N is always equal to the maximum bitwidth of the numerator. So for a 32-bit integer, N=32. I'll see if Daniel can add some clarification to the blog post.
So nkurz is correct that, in the paper, N is always equal to the maximum bitwidth of the numerator. I was not careful enough to make sure that the notation of the paper matches the notation of the blog post. So the N from the blog post is the F from the paper. I am sorry about this.
I added the following footnote.
"What is N? If both the numerator n and the divisor d are 32-bit unsigned integers, then you can pick N=64. This is not the smallest possible value. The smallest possible value is given by Algorithm 2 in our paper and it involves a bit of mathematics (note: the notation in my blog post differs from the paper, N becomes F)."
To make it super simple, if you have 32-bit values, then pick N (from the blog post) to be 64 and you are all set. You can do better, but this requires knowing what the divisor is.
Just curious, did you try making x an 8-bit integer to see if the compiler chose a different multiplier?
Here's a repo with 2 tests, counting bits, and calculating sine/cosine: https://github.com/Const-me/LookupTables
Neither code is particularly cheap but still faster than RAM.
clang 7
gcc 8.2 msvc 19 icc 19 The same, but when input unsigned char:clang 7
gcc 8.2 msvc 19 icc 19 clang and gcc with -O3, msvc -O2https://godbolt.org/z/bS2yzB
But also note that when the input is unsigned short we get:
https://godbolt.org/z/sbDbMU
Montgomery reduction requires an augmented number system with conversions to and from. The article's approach works on numbers directly, but if I understand it correctly the multiplications are twice the width.
Are these two methods algebraically related? Would it be possible to get fastmod working without the double width?
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montgomery_modular_multiplicat...
The idea is not novel and goes back to at least 1973 (Jacobsohn). However, engineering matters because computer registers have finite number of bits, and multiplications can overflow. I believe that, historically, this was first introduced into a major compiler (the GNU GCC compiler) by Granlund and Montgomery (1994). While GNU GCC and the Go compiler still rely on the approach developed by Granlund and Montgomery, other compilers like LLVM’s clang use a slightly improved version described by Warren in his book Hacker’s Delight.