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Re:Huawei Could Divide the World by BeetleB on Friday December 21, 2018 @02:58PM (#18736093)
Ignoring Turkish folks and Erdogan, the notion that living in a democracy has clear advantages is really propaganda.

I've lived in an absolute monarchy with human rights violations. I can also list a number of democracies with human rights violations, as well as very poor infrastructure, poor economy, violence, etc.

For many in the latter countries, they'll easily trade their democracy to get food, education for kids, and security.

Some democracies do well. Others don't. It's not an indicator of quality of life, and Maslow's hierarchy of needs is largely applicable.

Re:Huawei Could Divide the World by duxup on Friday December 21, 2018 @03:02PM (#18736115)
Good point.

I guess I should specify that I was thinking of the "good democracies". I get there can be things people don't like about any of them, but I figured the trade offs between those and totalitarianism was self evident if you lived in one, I guess I was wrong.

Re:Huawei Could Divide the World by BeetleB on Friday December 21, 2018 @05:00PM (#18737073)
>but I figured the trade offs between those and totalitarianism was self evident if you lived in one, I guess I was wrong.

Have you lived in that totalitarianism, though? And are you aware of their perceptions of the shortcomings in your society?

Speaking more broadly, though, how great you think life is under certain circumstances is a function of your model of the world, and thus your ideology (once you get beyond food, shelter and security).

Another aspect I've found: People who come from a country with a lot of "problems" have developed their minds to be relatively tolerant/immune to them. But small issues in the country they move to are large for them, as they've not built mental defenses against them. Don't underestimate this aspect. I recall once when I was in school a conversation between two foreign students (from different countries). A was complaining about B's culture, and was itemizing the headaches. B countered with all the problems A's culture had. A responded with "Yeah, but I know how to deal with all those problems!"

Re:Huawei Could Divide the World by notfromhere on Friday December 21, 2018 @03:37PM (#18736408)
kind of hard to imagine people living in Germany and thinking "oh, this erdogan guy has the right idea"
Re:Huawei Could Divide the World by BeetleB on Friday December 21, 2018 @04:54PM (#18737028)
Your comment is completely irrelevant to mine, given how I explicitly am not talking about Erdogan, Germany, or Turkish people in Germany.