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Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by chii on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @06:20PM (#18613770)
It's not like the specific job is the only thing you can do - there are other jobs that don't break the NC. 100% is too high, and 50% is too low. But the amount should be negotiable for each person.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by BonesJustice on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @07:05PM (#18614081)
You are most valuable in a position that leverages your existing skills and expertise. Those positions are the most likely to be covered by NCAs.

Not only is 100% not too much, but it’s the minimum that should be required. The cost of requiring a NCA should be high; that ensures they are only used when they are really worth it to the employer.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @09:24PM (#18614859)
> You are most valuable in a position that leverages your existing skills and expertise.

Exactly. So per the non-compete, you'd have to take a position where you are only 40% as valuable as you could be—and the 60% noncompete makes up the difference.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by cialowicz on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @10:56PM (#18615263)
What about the opportunity loss that results from taking a less relevant job with worse career prospects?
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by mcv on Thursday December 06, 2018 @03:53AM (#18616400)
That sounds like a bad idea, but you could also take it as an opportunity to develop in a new direction and build some experience there.

It's probably a bad deal for people who are extremely specialised and want to stay that way, but it'd be a pretty good deal for people like me, who love an excuse to learn something new.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by code_beers on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @10:47PM (#18615217)
So what, I’m only expected to bring 40% of my abilities to my next job? That makes mathematical sense, but it’s impossible in practice. It would be like trying to use 40% of your arms.

If an honest engineer sees a problem which is exactly the same as one she solved at a previous company, and it is still the best solution, she will solve it in the same way. This has nothing to do with company secrets, it’s basic tradecraft. But it’s covered in many of these agreements. They’ve got to go, plain and simple.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by Wowfunhappy on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @11:50PM (#18615507)
You're expected to do your best at your next job—but because it's not the most appropriate job for you, you're actual performance is probably some percentage less than what it could be elsewhere. This can in turn be an opportunity to diversify your overall skillset.

(I was of course being a bit facetious with the 40% metric—real life isn't quite so simple—but saying the noncompete should have 100% compensation is silly. That would only make sense if your ability to work was being completely taken away)

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by SoylentYellow on Thursday December 06, 2018 @12:36AM (#18615688)
How is 100% compensation silly? Non-compete agreements restrict your ability to freely practice your craft. They are prone to being improperly applied or outright abused (see Jimmy John's audacious non-compete clause). This has happened so often that California practically outlawed them. The root of the problem is that a boiler plate non-compete clause in every employee contract costs nothing. The company can pick and choose when to enforce it, so why not include it? Requiring 100% compensation forces companies to justify the non-compete with their pocket book. This is a powerful feedback mechanism that balances restricting a person's basic rights with legitimate business needs.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by code_beers on Thursday December 06, 2018 @12:40PM (#18620227)
Why exactly would I choose a company which will professionally handicap me for the rest of my career, locking 60% of my income potential at what it is now and leaving me to sort through how to have a career without getting sued? Ain’t gonna happen. Not going to sign the agreement. Like I said, it may sound mathematically right, but it’s absolutely absurd.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by gshulegaard on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @07:24PM (#18614187)
> You are most valuable in a position that leverages your existing skills and expertise.

For me the key word here is "most". I interpreted the previous comment as implying that previous employers should pay for the opportunity cost of you not maximizing your value.

Unless you are prevented from getting job that leverages _any_ of your previous experience...such as requiring a new career shift. In that case 100% compensation could be merited. Otherwise 100% is not likely to equal the opportunity cost to the employee.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by logfromblammo on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @07:01PM (#18614049)
Not being able to work a job on your career path freezes it in place, while your physical body continues to age at the same rate. Thus, there is even a case to be made for > 100% compensation.

If you don't choose to retire a year later, the year you sit out is costing you what you would have been making in the last year of your career.

To explain in more detail, starting with the year you return to a career job, your pay may be reduced by a differential representing one year less experience, for every year until the end of your career. You miss out on the pay for the year you didn't work, plus all the raises between years, and the one raise you never got, because your career was one year shorter. All that adds up to the pay you would have otherwise received in the last year of your career.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by cgriswald on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @11:01PM (#18615288)
It should probably be more than 100%. You don’t just miss out on salary. You miss out on raises and promotions, which might put you behind. You miss out on opportunities that may be gone with the NC period is over. Depending on the work, keeping your skills honed might be impossible from home.

The problem is that 60% is not about making you whole. It’s about discouraging NCs in general.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by CoolGuySteve on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @08:47PM (#18614683)
That doesn't stop companies from asserting that their non-compete is more broad than it is. Once they do, no other company is going to risk having you work for them while that illegally-broad non-compete is in effect.

You can sue but it's so expensive you probably won't and the company knows it.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by mirimir on Thursday December 06, 2018 @12:45AM (#18615727)
That can happen even without a formal noncompete agreement.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by walshemj on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @06:45PM (#18613948)
But many countries ban people being allowed to ply their trade which is why non competes to be enforceable have to be narrowly drawn.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by luckydata on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @06:48PM (#18613959)
that's disingenuous, it's very hard to find a job that doesn't look exactly like the 5 last jobs you had. If you want to fix that you gotta fix the labor market and hiring practices first, which is wishful thinking. 60% is low.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by adrianratnapala on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @06:54PM (#18614004)
> it's very hard to find a job that doesn't look exactly like the 5 last jobs you had

That's funny, I've never had a job that was exactly like any of the other jobs I've had. Depending on how picky you are, I've never had a job that was even particularly similar to any of my previous ones.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by akoncius on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @07:28PM (#18614208)
I was thinking the same because I am a programmer and it’s quite easy to find programming job in another area. But then I thought about other industries, dor example if I’m researcher about LED lights for 20 years, then my other options for another non-LED related job is very limited. So I’m confident that there are many example as this which can prove your logic (and my initial thinking too) wrong.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by cortesoft on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @07:01PM (#18614055)
Really? All of your jobs have been for competitors of each other? I don't think that is the case for most people.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by luckydata on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @08:25PM (#18614590)
Most non-competes are usually imposed on very specialized professions like market analysts and accountants at global firms for example. If you're barred from working for another financial firm for 2 years, what are you going to do?

I'm surprised to see such a narrow view about this issue on this forum.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by ghaff on Wednesday December 05, 2018 @09:15PM (#18614811)
One area of non-competes I'm somewhat familiar with is consultants/analysts for a particular market. If they leave, sure, they can go work for a vendor or other participant in a different side of the market. Which is a very different job. But they basically can't do their role with another firm or independently. And my understanding is that these non-competes are regularly enforced.
Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by tlavoie on Friday December 07, 2018 @01:16AM (#18625537)
A company I worked for had something like this, basically along the lines of, "you can't poach customers or other employees for a year." You likely could still work on your own as a consultant in the same field, but what it appeared to disallow was trying to take your clients with you.

The company was acquired, (and that in turn), when the new parent tried rolling out new contracts per employee, with a short turnaround to sign. Among other things, the new version basically would have prevented me from working in my field for a year.

I told them I needed time to have it reviewed by my lawyer, and I did too. Sure, the backlash had them rolling back the demand forthwith, but it convinced me that the ideal time to leave was immediately, under my old contract.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by dfxm12 on Thursday December 06, 2018 @09:52AM (#18618444)
I'm surprised to see such a narrow view about this issue on this forum.

This forum oddly has some anti-labor sentiment. It is seen in this thread and also in threads related to unions, where the tone is quite obviously anti-union.

Re:Send Noncompete Agreements Back to the Middle Ages by mindcrime on Thursday December 06, 2018 @12:45PM (#18620275)
What's odd about being anti-union? Depending, I guess, on how exactly you define "anti-union".

Me, I'm very anti-union in that I never want to be part of one, but OTOH, I fully support their right to exist as simply the collective extension to the individual members' right to bargain.