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Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Monday July 16, 2018 @07:36AM (#17540451)
Yes, but not only Rust, rather any memory safe system programming language all the way back to ESPOL in 1961.

In those languages you have "Logic errors" to debug, in C and its direct descendants you have "Logic errors" + "UB errors" + "Memory corruption errors" to debug.

Also having the use of unsafe explicit in the type system, means that it is relatively easy to track down where such issues might occur, whereas in C every line of code can be a source of problems, depending on which compiler and flags are being used.

Again, this applies to all memory safe system programming language, not just Rust.

EDIT: Fixed the NEWP reference, as ESPOL came first and NEWP only replaced it in 1976.

Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by coldtea on Monday July 16, 2018 @10:17AM (#17541394)
>Yes, but not only Rust, rather any memory safe system programming language all the way back to ESPOL in 1961.

Yes, but now we're discussing only those that practically matter to more than 5 people today.

Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Monday July 16, 2018 @11:15AM (#17541923)
I bet Unisys MCP deployments still matter to more than 5 people.

Plus the point was to talk about safe systems programming languages in general.

Or should we ignore history just because UNIX won on the server?

Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by tzahola on Monday July 16, 2018 @01:20PM (#17543010)
What’s this “UNIX”? A Linux distribution?
Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Monday July 16, 2018 @01:45PM (#17543262)
Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by coldtea on Monday July 16, 2018 @03:12PM (#17544074)
His point is probably UNIX didn't won -- Linux did.
Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Monday July 16, 2018 @03:23PM (#17544202)
Linux is non-certified copy of UNIX, without POSIX it wouldn't matter in the marketplace, ergo UNIX won.
Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by vetinari on Monday July 16, 2018 @04:52PM (#17544995)
As you can see in the wild, nobody really cares about UNIX certification. Ergo, UNIX didn't win.
Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Monday July 16, 2018 @05:16PM (#17545207)
The fact is that the Linux kernel without the APIs copied from POSIX/UNIX and the userspace copied from UNIX is useless on the server space.

Of course we can play semantic games about the use of UNIX word, and GNU/Linux not sharing any code from either BSD or AT&T linage, it doesn't make it any less UNIX.

Had Linux not copied UNIX, and provided a playground for UNIX vendors kind of outsource their development costs, it would have turned out to yet another hobby OS.

Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by vetinari on Monday July 16, 2018 @06:26PM (#17545707)
NT had POSIX subsystem too.

What Linux (and NT POSIX to certain degree) allowed, was to move the existing investment in software from hodge-podge of mutually incompatible, but expensive UNIX systems, to somewhere else.

Re:Rav1e: An experimental AV1 video encoder, designed to be ... by pjmlp on Tuesday July 17, 2018 @12:33AM (#17547348)
NT isn't a copy of UNIX, just because it had support for the first edition of POSIX, it goes beyond than that.

Starting by wanting to copy Minix, an educational OS that copied UNIX, getting the GNU tools on board (which goal was to copy UNIX), kernel architecture, device drivers subsystems, userland, culture, ....

My old stack of Linux Journal editions at home are pretty clear what the ongoing story was.

If NT was a copy of anything, it was VMS given Dave Cutler's contribution to its design.