News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by jscipione on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:11PM (#17377394)
"Government investigators suspect that he provided WikiLeaks, the anti-secrecy organization, with a stolen archive of documents detailing the C.I.A.’s hacking operations, but they had not initially charged him in that crime."

Wikileaks is a news organization, not an anti-secrecy organization who's First Amendment Right to Freedom of the Press has been illegally infringed upon by the US Government.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by burger_moon on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:38PM (#17377612)
They don't actually publish news articles like the NYTimes though right? anti-secrecy seems to be a part of what wikileaks does but I'm not sure that would be an appropriate name either.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by krapp on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:41PM (#17378454)
>They don't actually publish news articles like the NYTimes though right?

No, they publish classified documents. What they do is more akin to public espionage than journalism.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zaroth on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:35PM (#17378690)
Ever heard of the Pentagon Papers?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by krapp on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:51PM (#17378747)
Yes. But the press didn't simply publish them in their entirety without comment or context, did they?

I understand people want to lionize Wikileaks and consider Julian Assange to be the modern day equivalent to Woodward and Bernstein, but to consider what they do journalism is to discredit journalism. There's a reason Edward Snowden went to the actual press and not Wikileaks.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by mmjaa on Monday June 25, 2018 @06:09AM (#17391166)
>Yes. But the press didn't simply publish them in their entirety without comment or context, did they?

Even better - Senator Gravel, doing his job, brought them into Congress .. something that was necessary, because the press was compromised and wasn't doing their job.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by wyldfire on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:12PM (#17377403)
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by colordrops on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:49PM (#17377705)
Calling wikileaks a propaganda arm of the Russian Government is just US propaganda. 1984 double-speak here. Can you point to ANYTHING that wikileaks has reported or released that is untrue?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by alpha_squared on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:17PM (#17377942)
You can tell the truth and still be deceitful. Claiming to have had evidence on Russian corruption and publicly declaring an intent to release followed by silence and unwillingness to do so indicate two things, to me anyway.

1. The original claim is a lie. There is no evidence of Russian corruption and the claim was made for attention or some other purpose. Remind me, again, how many lies it takes to make someone untrustworthy?

2. The original claim is true, but something or someone prevents information from being released. This is the more insidious reason. It means that the organization will only release "the truth" that jibes with the messages/agenda they want to push, which is propaganda. Regardless of whether or not Russia has a direct influence of the release is unknown, but it becomes propaganda nonetheless.

My personal opinion is that Assange is virtually inseparable from Wikileaks and appears to have a god complex, using the platform as his mouthpiece on his view of the state of things while enjoying the comforts of avoiding consequence.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by colordrops on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:26PM (#17378006)
By that measure, the New York Times, Fox News, Washington Post, CNN, and Wall Street Journal are all propaganda.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by abiox on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:34PM (#17378062)
they have their moments. they all tend to be good at cheerleading war, for example. msnbc fired phil donohue for being against the iraq war. last election, the washington post (in)famously ran a glut of anti-sanders material in a short time span (16 articles in 16 hours, i believe it was).
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:56PM (#17378212)
You see there was that little thing called the Iraq war.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by boomboomsubban on Saturday June 23, 2018 @02:27AM (#17379857)
>My personal opinion is that Assange is virtually inseparable from Wikileaks and appears to have a god complex, using the platform as his mouthpiece on his view of the state of things while enjoying the comforts of avoiding consequence

Except around eight years of imprisonment now. It being a relatively nice imprisonment doesn't change what it is.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by abiox on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:14PM (#17377930)
does anything necessarily need to be 'untrue'? (a lot of propaganda is 'true')
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by admiralEyebrows on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:55PM (#17377758)
Before scrambling to gather a handful of news articles (though no proof) which confirm 'option C' to avoid down votes, are you certain that you are not regurgitating the propaganda of a different government or corporation?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_cross-ownership_in_the_U...

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by LMYahooTFY on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:52PM (#17377734)
What evidence?

None of your links contain any "evidence".

Evidence shouldn't be difficult to explain. Loosely connected assumptions, however, are often difficult to articulate.

The argument you propose is that practically anyone who exposes corruption in western organizations could be Russian government propagandists.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by DINKDINK on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:43PM (#17377659)
Do you mind enlightening us how Wikileaks was a propaganda arm of the Russian government when they released video of US war crimes (murder of journalists in the Collateral Murder video)?

If another news organization received the DNC leaks and chose to not publish them, do you think that would have been ethical?

Is your position that, one cannot be a US citizen and oppose the US government and if you do you're a Russian agent?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rosser on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:49PM (#17377707)
The selectivity of Wikileaks' leaks put the lie to their claim of being a journalistic entity.

Julian Assange has an agenda against certain people/parties, and has demonstrably leaked things that support that, and not leaked things that refute it.

I say that as a detractor of many of the same people and institutions Assange dislikes, so check your assumptions of bias before you throw them, please.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by woah on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:43PM (#17378711)
Weird definition of a "journalistic entity" I don't think that any news source satisfies your requirement that it be complete non-partisan, even such a thing was even logically possible.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rosser on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:56PM (#17378769)
I don't expect journalism to be non-partisan. I expect it to be affirmatively transparent about its partisanship.

You're right, though, that nothing actually meets that bar. It's a human institution; it's necessarily flawed. That's why you source across biases and ideologies, and correct accordingly.

The thing I'm talking about is instead the deliberate pretense of not being partisan. Fox News calling itself "fair and balanced", or claiming "We report. You decide." are just particularly egregious examples. When you aren't presenting enough of the picture for someone to form an informed opinion, you're peddling propaganda. I know the propagandist can't admit that's what he's doing, so I hold journalism to the standard of integrity of knowing, and owning, its biases.

But it's ultimately a spectrum, and it's on me to gauge where on that spectrum any given source lands. Some things are more propaganda than journalism. Some things are more or less one or the other to different degrees on different topics, at the same time. Sometimes they're at different points on the same topic, on different days, or in different stories.

It's complicated, sure. But, holding as nuanced an appreciation of this mess as I hope I've implied, I hope also that you'll give me the credit of not merely talking out my ass when I say I find Assange to be towards the propagandist pole.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Saturday June 23, 2018 @02:03AM (#17379784)
>You're right, though, that nothing actually meets that bar.

Then your post is content free. If you find nothing to meet your personal standard of being journalism than you finding wikileaks to not be journalists merely means they are the same as the New York Times.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rosser on Saturday June 23, 2018 @03:01AM (#17379938)
>> But it's ultimately a spectrum, and it's on me to gauge where on that spectrum any given source lands.

In no way did I claim, or even imply some sort of equivalence between Wikileaks and the NYT. Please don't put words in my mouth which I explicitly disclaim just two paragraphs later.

My point is more that it's impracticable to impossible to share all of our biases, not least because we aren't aware of so many of them. When we've internalized a narrative, it becomes an unconscious bias, and can't very well be meaningfully disclosed.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by boomboomsubban on Saturday June 23, 2018 @05:53AM (#17380437)
Please demonstrate all the examples where Wikileals could have leaked things that refute that agenda and chose not to.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by DINKDINK on Saturday June 23, 2018 @10:08PM (#17384562)
>The selectivity of Wikileaks' leaks

What GOP documents did Wikileaks receive that they didn’t release?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by vkou on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:57PM (#17377787)
> The selectivity of Wikileaks' leaks put the lie to their claim of being a journalistic entity.

It really doesn't, though. You don't have to be unbiased to be a journalist, a journalistic entity, or whatever you want to call it.

Fox News, biased as it is, is still news.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rosser on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:01PM (#17377821)
Fox News isn't journalism. It's opinion wrapped around selective "reporting".

EDIT: Yes, of course it's impossible to eliminate bias. To extrapolate from that to accepting overtly biased and selectively published content as journalism is unsupported, at best.

It's the selectivity of reporting that compromises the claim of journalism, not the bias. When you don't report on things that don't support your narrative, you're no longer reporting.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by EdSharkey on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:41PM (#17378107)
American journalism is pathetic. I hope you're just using Fox News as an example and not singling them out as the only exemplar.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rosser on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:43PM (#17378127)
Of course not.

They're among the worst offenders, they're far from alone in playing that game.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by rspeer on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:59PM (#17377806)
The WikiLeaks that released the "Collateral Murder" video was a very different thing from the Russian organization that exists today.

That WikiLeaks even had a wiki.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by gowld on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:05PM (#17377857)
WikiLeaks has a long and ongoing history, and Assange founded it long before the Russia stuff. When and how did it change?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:55PM (#17378208)
Dear god this thread is being hit hard by people pushing the US government narrative. I'm not saying you're all paid trolls, but HN is to the tech scene what reddit was 10 years ago which is when we first saw shilling hit it hard and fast.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:06PM (#17378266)
Look in the mirror, man. You're accusing people, without a shred of evidence, of being government shills simply because you disagree with them.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Friday June 22, 2018 @11:19PM (#17379330)
I'm looking at your post history. At the point when you have posted 17 times in a thread with half of them being a literal copy of what the prosecution is charging him with, while by omission implying that the information there is somehow impartial, the fact of being a paid or unpaid shill is immaterial.

You are the only person in this thread pushing the government narrative and taking their words at face value.

Anyone who has kept track of these persecutions knows that unmentionable facts are thrown in constantly to try and get the defendants to break. Viz, Daniel Ellsberg being called a homosexual.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by vkou on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:55PM (#17377762)
Good God. I don't like Wikileaks, but even if they are a 'propaganda arm of the Russian government', they still have First Amendment rights, and they are still a news organization.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by JumpCrisscross on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:34PM (#17378058)
> they still have First Amendment rights, and they are still a news organization

I agree. But the First Amendment doesn’t protect individuals or companies from any and all prosecution.