Poverty/Homelessness is a cycle. Once you're in it, it becomes exponentially harder to climb out the longer you are in it. Even if you maintain your mental faculties, don't have a drug/alcohol problem, and are willing to work - doesn't mean you will find a job. In cities it is a bit easier to take the first job that comes up, but if you live in a rural area you are subject to geography. Maybe the only job that is hiring is 30 miles away and you can't get there because your car is broken down.
>>Living isnt hard to do in first world countries where food is plentiful, jobs pay decent, and getting space to live in is cheap.
I don't know your history but this seems like a comment made by someone who has never had to struggle for those things. It is absolute hard for some, just as it comes easily for others. Casting out blanket statements like this does nothing other than turn a blind eye to an issue.
It was about mental illness.
Either way, your point doesn't make sense.
If you are saying it IS a mental health issue, than pointing out how easy it is to find work and how cheap living is in rural areas has nothing to do with that point.
If you are saying it is NOT a mental health issue, then my counter arguments stand. Poverty is a cycle that affects even those with good mental health.
1. Cheap housing exists ($400-500/mo)
2. Minimum wage jobs are readily available in the areas that the cheap housing exists
3. Working a minimum wage job and living in said areas is preferable to being homeless
4. The primary reason someone might choose not to, or be unable to, take that path is mental illness
5. Therefore, homelessness must be a mental health problem
There are a number of ways to attack this, but "ease of finding housing and jobs" is actually relevant to his argument - namely, that because such opportunities exist and the homeless are not taking them, there must be something preventing the homeless from taking them (and that something is mental illness)
Probably because when we see a visibly homeless person, they are also very obviously mentally ill. There are lots of "invisible homeless" - in the sense that they don't look homeless, because they're not pushing a shopping cart around, aren't nursing oozing sores, and don't smell like they haven't bathed in two weeks.
Last fall, I was walking in my neighborhood and saw a woman asleep in her car. She didn't look like she pulled over to take a nap because she was too tired to drive safely; she looked like she was living in her car. But she looked just like any other person you'd pass in the street.
So, you're right, but it doesn't mean that homelessness-due-to-poverty doesn't exist.
I think most people who have a problem with the homeless, myself included, are speaking primarily about people living on the street and very obviously either A) addicted to drugs, or B) mentally unwell. Whereas it seems that people who advocate for the homeless are advocating mostly for people who have fallen on hard times and are struggling to get by.
FWIW, I don't think people who are anti-homeless really have much of a problem with somebody who is sleeping in their car because they're struggling financially. But we do have a problem with people who live out of their car because drugs and/or mental illness render them unable to participate productively in society.
It only takes one person to file a complaint to the police about someone living in a vehicle on their street. It is, de-facto, a crime in most cities.
https://www.apartments.com/559-vincent-ave-bronx-ny/0kg0371/
Its not the south, but its detroit craigslist.
I see 2 ads for 500 dollars on the front page, both mention multiple bedrooms.
Have you tried craiglist in rural areas?
Most places do not have apartments at $500 per month. I am willing to talk about how to find a roommate situation in that price range, but most homeless people have special needs, whether medical or mental health, that make them unsuited to a roommate situation or a roommate situation unsuitable for them.
I am interested in specific names of cities, websites with good search parameters for finding such and other general advice on how to get it that low. I've done a lot of searching and listings that are substantially below $500 are pretty rare in my experience.
I'm happy to be proven wrong. I would like to do a write up on one of my blogs for where you can find truly cheap housing if you have portable income.
Thanks to folks who have already replied. Feel free to shoot me an email with such info to avoid cluttering up this discussion too much.
It was not the best housing, but a 2 bedroom duplex (only 1 half of the duplex was included, that half had 2 bedrooms, I don't know how many bedrooms were in the other half). Trash, electricity, and water were not included in this price.
How recently was this roughly?
The locals that are homeless here are not in that situation because of some fixable problem with a city policy. It's unanimously mental illness or drug problems, often both.
This is also the county seat, and where the welfare offices are located. 80% of the properties in the city are rentals, and there are multiple charity organizations that provide discount housing.
Homelessness is not a problem that will be eliminated until we no longer have people that cannot take care of themselves.
The bank never emailed me. I was unable to log in to my application for some reason to check it's status. I emailed a mortgage officer at the bank. They asked for my phone number. They never called me.
I have since decided I don't want a house in the burbs. I want to stay downtown. That's an entirely different process.
But I have earned income and decent credit and 6 years of college etc and I am finding it challenging to arrange to purchase real estate. I have had these conversations on HN before with people and it always seems to be an assertion that comes from privilege and cluelessness about what reality is like if your income is low.
I have done internet searches for dirt cheap housing across multiple states. The truly dirt cheap stuff frequently says stuff like "No foundation. Will not qualify for financing. Cash buyer only."
If I had a few $10k cash laying around, I would handily qualify for a conventional mortgage because that would cover down payment and closing costs. So, no, I can't buy the houses listed at a mere $10k or $20k that theoretically would have super low monthly payments because that just isn't how that works.
People who have challenges to taking care of themselves can sometimes manage it if they can arrange decent housing that is super cheap. I'm medically handicapped and I manage to work part time. I am currently in a super cheap rental and off the street.
I paid my student loan off last July and was in housing in early September. Student loans are a pox on this nation, impoverishing a great many people. You don't need to be mentally ill or addicted for that to be a huge and problematic burden.
I'm not asking you to solve homelessness. I'm just looking to crowdsource a little information. It would be nice if folks refrained from raining on my parade and trying to tell me to not bother to try to do anything about the problem.
Thanks.
I lived in a crappy apartment for 4 years while working my first real job to save up enough money for a down payment on a house.
I bought a house at age 27 with zero down and no money to cover closing costs. I know something about wheeling and dealing in real estate.
The fact that I was recently homeless is not evidence that I don't know anything about real estate. I had student loans and a lengthy health crisis.
To be as clear as possible, I wasn't describing the issues I have run into in order to indicate that I personally can't pull this off. Just describing what can be involved and trying to indicate that it can be a dead end for a lot of people with a low income. I don't expect it to be a dead end for me, though it has proven to be a speed bump.
Minimum wage workers don't exist?
Sure you might have some teens that dont realize they can make more than minimum wage, but thats about it. Ive meet moms that work for under minimum wage if they can watch their kid (work from home).
But these are not the homeless.
(Having said that, all the example people mentioned in the article are there from forms of "mental health" issues; "mental breakdown"/abused child leaving 'care'/bad divorce)
Then there's the huge numbers of families in "temporary" accomodation. It's so bad that even the Grenfell survivors are in this state: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/29/100-househol...
In the UK, for a single bed flat in an area with jobs you're looking at £1000 a month. You'll earn just over £12,000 a year on minimum wage - and there are plenty of minimum wage workers here - about 7% of working people.
The cheapest you will find a house to buy is about £90k - for a ruin, on Orkney. In a city, £200k+ - and you'd better have a 25% deposit if you don't want a penurious rate.
Gas is $7.90 a gallon, and that transport cost is reflected in most consumer goods.
I’m within walking distance of central London, and single rooms here are available for about £100/wk, and if you need a full one-bed flat it’ll be around £200/wk. A one-bed flat can be purchased for about 150k in the same area.
Property is substantially cheaper almost anywhere else in the country. In Glasgow, for example, £100/wk would cover the rent on a one-bed flat, and 50k can buy you a two-bed flat.
90% mortgages are available with interest rates under 4%, which is hardly punitive.
There are many problems with housing costs in the UK, but we don’t do anybody any favours without being honest about the numbers.
The cheapest room I can find in a flat share is £550 a month - although for the numbers you mention, you could rent an outdoor parking space.
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/find.html?locati...
So yes, there are options that are cheaper than I posited, but it's still hardly the $400 a month for a house you see in the US.
To buy, for under £150k, all I can see is garages, boats, and sub-decade leaseholds - you can't live in a garage, a boat costs a fortune to maintain and moor, and a six year lease for £150k is a bum deal in my view, and not really ownership.
Would love to be proven wrong.
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/find.html?locat...
You can get a place to live for 400/mo dollars in the south, and easily 500$/mo with roommates in 'civilization' where there are high paying jobs.
None of this is particularly difficult to afford, even for minimum wage workers(who dont really exist).
I find this an odd topic. Living isnt hard to do in first world countries where food is plentiful, jobs pay decent, and getting space to live in is cheap.