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Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by dirkgently on Sunday June 03, 2018 @06:39PM (#17222783)
Stop bashing Google without any proofs. They do respect privacy and don't share data you elect not to. In fact, their take out tool was released in 2009 or something, way before GRPR made others do it too.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by zer00eyz on Sunday June 03, 2018 @06:52PM (#17222873)
Uhhhh your doing this backwards. Prove that google is protecting my privacy not the other way around.

The default state for people needs to be DISTRUST of corporations (and governments) that they do not have a direct financial relationship with (when you aren't giving them cash).

I don't think that much of this holds water but it exists and the picture isn't one of "were standing up to defend your privacy" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privacy_concerns_regarding_Goo...

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by millstone on Sunday June 03, 2018 @07:07PM (#17222978)
It's insidious how Google has redefined "privacy" from "what's yours is yours" to "what's yours is ours, as long as we don't share it."

Microsoft is moving fast along the same path.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by not_kurt_godel on Sunday June 03, 2018 @11:14PM (#17224294)
[Replying to sibling comment]

> MS do not tie an analytics product (on most sites around the world) into the world's largest personal-data-mining and advertising network.

They're trying pretty damn hard with Windows 10, which by default collects pretty much every keystroke you make. That data in turn gets shared and sold to advertisers - see MS's own privacy page: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by wbillingsley on Sunday June 03, 2018 @11:03PM (#17224248)
I'm not convinced they are -- the models are entirely different. Google receives the vast bulk of its revenue from advertising based on mining what they know about you. Microsoft receives the vast bulk of its funding from companies using its systems and paying them to run them well.

MS do not tie an analytics product (on most sites around the world) into the world's largest personal-data-mining and advertising network.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by untog on Sunday June 03, 2018 @07:01PM (#17222931)
That's part of the problem: we have no idea what Google is doing with our data, so we have no idea if they are respecting privacy - assuming there is even a definition for such a thing.

The only answer is to simply gather less data, or be more explicit about when you do. And Google isn't great at either.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by joshuamorton on Sunday June 03, 2018 @08:37PM (#17223496)
In what ways is Google but explicit about what they collect?
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by untog on Sunday June 03, 2018 @09:58PM (#17223920)
One example that comes to mind is that Google Maps has started telling me when I've been somewhere before, like a restaurant. It's very useful information, but I do not recall an explicit prompt about Google collecting my location history in this way. Can advertisers target me based on this location history? I'm not sure. Does it affect how results are ordered on Maps? Probably. But I don't know.

Relatedly, Maps shows me when a location is likely to be popular vs unpopular. I have to assume that's based on the location history of everyone using Maps - seeing how long they spend in a place and at what time. But what percentage of Maps users are aware their information is being used in this way? I doubt the number is high.

Also, now I come to think of it, Google search itself. It shows different results sometimes when I'm logged in vs logged out, but it's not clear why. And I don't recall ever being asked if I wanted, say, my browsing history to influence future search results. It just does. Somehow.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by joshuamorton on Sunday June 03, 2018 @11:28PM (#17224360)
>It's very useful information, but I do not recall an explicit prompt about Google collecting my location history in this way.

You did.

It sounds like you want something different than transparency about when information is collected, but instead you want transparency about what information is used to give you a specific feature.

For example, you opted into location history a long time ago (likely), should Google again ask for your permission every time they add a new feature that takes advantage of your location history information? (assuming said features don't affect the privacy of your data)

That seems like a very strange onus.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by TeMPOraL on Monday June 04, 2018 @01:46AM (#17224987)
> instead you want transparency about what information is used to give you a specific feature

Not OP, but - sure, why not? It would be really nice to have that. Especially if it wasn't the meaningless kind of transparency, "we use your location data as well as past interests to provide this feature", but something concrete - "we use regular GPS/cellular/wifi location updates to determine places where you've stayed for longer and correlate that with your recent searches in Google, as well as visits to venue sites that use Google Analytics".

(Personally, I'd be fine with such concrete announcements popping up the first time you use the app after a new feature was added, and if a feature is something one might want to not use, I'd be happy with it being opt-out. Just don't surprise people with application suddenly doing new things by itself, without much prior warning.)

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by joshuamorton on Monday June 04, 2018 @11:27AM (#17228657)
>Not OP, but - sure, why not?

Because if we lived in that reality, you'd end up complaining about how Google was sending you unwanted marketing emails about new features multiple times per week, and I'd be arguing that they were emails discussing new privacy updates.

Not to say that no one would want that, but as someone who does, by way of working at Google, more or less get emails similar to the technical descriptions of newly released features you want, very few of them are relevant to me.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by TeMPOraL on Monday June 04, 2018 @11:47AM (#17228997)
> you'd end up complaining about how Google was sending you unwanted marketing emails about new features multiple times per week

Maybe they'd combat the perception I have of Google - that they just do UI redesign every couple of months, which more often than not lose useful features than add anything of value.

You say you get lots of those e-mails internally; I'd love to know where Google is actually adding all those features - because it definitely doesn't seem to be Inbox, or GMail, or Google Maps.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by robin_reala on Monday June 04, 2018 @12:24AM (#17224619)
Actually, if you’re in the EU then GDPR makes that explicit: consent for the use of collected data must be tied to granular functionality. You can’t now collect data and use it for indiscriminate purposes.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by joshuamorton on Monday June 04, 2018 @01:12AM (#17224841)
I think (keyword think) you have that a bit mixed up. additional functionality using the same data is fine. But you cannot collect data without a specific use case. "Future features" might be a legit use, but then people should be able to opt out.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by robin_reala on Monday June 04, 2018 @02:43AM (#17225190)
I don’t believe you’re right (though I’m welcome to be proved wrong). Assuming the consent basis, GDPR requires that consent needs to be for a given set of data and a defined processing model. You can’t process the same data in a different way without getting new consent, and you can’t collect data indiscriminately. So saying “additional functionality using the same data is fine” is true if and only if your original consent was wide enough to include that additional processing, but consent needs to be “granular” at the same time. Tbh it’s all a bit up in the air at the moment until some case law happens. Also obviously if you’re using a different basis then none of this applies.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by staticassertion on Sunday June 03, 2018 @11:00PM (#17224236)
> but I do not recall an explicit prompt about Google collecting my location history in this way.

Weird, I'm pretty sure with my new Android phone, upon booting it up for the first time, I had to opt in to location services and a little popup explained exactly what it was doing.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by pmontra on Monday June 04, 2018 @12:48AM (#17224745)
I'm on Android 8.0 with location services and history turned off. I'm also logged out from all Google services except Play (I want to update apps.) It works perfectly.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by brandmeyer on Monday June 04, 2018 @08:51AM (#17227213)
> Relatedly, Maps shows me when a location is likely to be popular vs unpopular. I have to assume that's based on the location history of everyone using Maps

This is based on the location history of everyone using Android. Its the Google Location Services requests going back and forth all the time that tells them where people go.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by bryanrasmussen on Sunday June 03, 2018 @06:52PM (#17222875)
I believe that Google's theory is what mine would be in similar circumstances, why sell the data to a business when you can use that data to build a competing business.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by nhebb on Sunday June 03, 2018 @08:09PM (#17223336)
There is a YouTube update that's been pending on my Android for 1-1/2 years. I haven't agreed to it because YouTube decided that it needs access to my contacts. IMO, if Google needs to know who I communicate with in order to watch videos, they don't respect my privacy at all.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by curun1r on Sunday June 03, 2018 @08:30PM (#17223450)
On the other hand, a Google product (YouTube) is asking for permission to access information already available to another Google product (Android). If Google had no respect for your privacy, they wouldn't even ask.

Respect for privacy is a continuum and Google isn't on either extreme. I'd even go so far as to say that different parts of Google have different stances on privacy. People who try to make them into a monolith with a single binary stance on the issue are lacking nuance.

Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by nhebb on Monday June 04, 2018 @01:18AM (#17224876)
I don't think it's an issue that deserves nuance because it's not unreasonable that they should behave as a monolith with regard to privacy. It should be a top-down corporate policy.
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by neop1x on Tuesday June 05, 2018 @04:40AM (#17235904)
I stopped using official Youtube long ago. I recommend SkyTube and NewPipe. They are awesome!
Re:Microsoft Is Said to Have Agreed to Acquire GitHub by Nuzzerino on Sunday June 03, 2018 @06:49PM (#17222849)
So they don't share data with the government? Tell us more.