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Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by pjmlp on Friday March 30, 2018 @03:05PM (#16718885)
To bring another example of worse is better, regarding how C's industry adoption caused a regression in compiler optimizations research.

"Oh, it was quite a while ago. I kind of stopped when C came out. That was a big blow. We were making so much good progress on optimizations and transformations. We were getting rid of just one nice problem after another. When C came out, at one of the SIGPLAN compiler conferences, there was a debate between Steve Johnson from Bell Labs, who was supporting C, and one of our people, Bill Harrison, who was working on a project that I had at that time supporting automatic optimization...The nubbin of the debate was Steve's defense of not having to build optimizers anymore because the programmer would take care of it. That it was really a programmer's issue....

Seibel: Do you think C is a reasonable language if they had restricted its use to operating-system kernels?

Allen: Oh, yeah. That would have been fine. And, in fact, you need to have something like that, something where experts can really fine-tune without big bottlenecks because those are key problems to solve. By 1960, we had a long list of amazing languages: Lisp, APL, Fortran, COBOL, Algol 60. These are higher-level than C. We have seriously regressed, since C developed. C has destroyed our ability to advance the state of the art in automatic optimization, automatic parallelization, automatic mapping of a high-level language to the machine. This is one of the reasons compilers are ... basically not taught much anymore in the colleges and universities."

-- Fran Allen interview, Excerpted from: Peter Seibel. Coders at Work: Reflections on the Craft of Programming

Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by mgummelt on Friday March 30, 2018 @03:32PM (#16719110)
I'm not sure the usage of C for apps is an example of worse is better so much as network effects. It's easier to write apps in the same language as the OS.
Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by bsder on Friday March 30, 2018 @04:22PM (#16719509)
In addition, C progressed because it was free.

People forget that compilers in the 1980's were expensive.

If you wanted something compiled other than assembly language, your choices were C (1987--gcc could generally bootstrap) and Pascal (1984--mostly TurboPascal) and ... nothing.

Look at what was sitting in Dr Dobbs Journal in the 1980's. People were typing in enormous programs in BASIC(!) in order to play with things like LISP and Prolog. Not a recipe for adoption ...

I remember getting stuck using some Macintosh Lisp thing in 1986/1987--I pined for my OS9 machine and C and the dulcet (not!) grind of it's floppy drive. That says something.

Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by pjmlp on Friday March 30, 2018 @05:11PM (#16719826)
C was not not free at all.

Small-C was probably the only dialect freely available, everything else was either commercial, or came for "free" with an UNIX workstation price tag.

In fact, it was due to Solaris change of heart regarding developers, that some devs started to contribute to GCC.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8988021

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8984454

I have a few editions of Dr Dobbs Journal comparing C compilers, all commercial, GCC was yet to be relevant.

Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by bsder on Friday March 30, 2018 @08:19PM (#16720889)
Okay, maybe C isn't free at the time, but you can get it for anywhere between $50-100 1985 dollars--that qualifies as fairly cheap--especially for the kinds of technically competent individuals who would buy such a thing.

So, what "better" language could you get for that price at that time?

Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by pjmlp on Saturday March 31, 2018 @01:11AM (#16721852)
Actually without bothering to go again diving into old magazines, it was more like $150 or more, with student discount.

Pascal compilers like Turbo Pascal, for example.

Re:The Rise of Worse Is Better (1991) by AdieuToLogic on Saturday March 31, 2018 @11:21AM (#16723648)
Aztec C[0], by Manx, cost about $200 USD in 1988. It came with a "complete" dev environment for PC-DOS (the version I have) which included:

- C compiler

- Assembler

- Linker

- Make

- Grep

- Z (an editor kinda like vi IIRC)

I remember it being able to make very small executables, which meant a lot at that time.

0 - https://archive.org/details/bitsavers_manxAztecClApr88_25693...