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Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by pishpash on Sunday February 11, 2018 @01:36PM (#16353999)
You don't excrete antibodies? I think you might be saying that antibiotics are passive strategies which are inherently overly broad and thus problematic.
Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by paviva on Sunday February 11, 2018 @02:38PM (#16354320)
As pointed out by IIIIIIIIIIIIIII, antibodies are way too massive and are not excreted in any significant amount (again, I am talking of normal physiology, not someone with very advanced kidney disease).

To give you an idea of the weight difference, an average human IgG[1] antibody is about 500 more massive than a pretty average small molecule antibiotic like levofloxacin[2]

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immunoglobulin_G

[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levofloxacin

Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by IIIIIIIIIIIIIII on Sunday February 11, 2018 @02:02PM (#16354156)
Antibodies are too large to pass through the filter in the kidneys. Lower molecular weight fragments of antibodies are usually reabsorbed in the proximal tubule of the nephron.

Their fate mostly lies in catabolism, i.e. they are broken down and the components reused. Biliary excretion accounts for a very small amount of the elimination of IgG antibodies.

[0] "Pharmacokinetics of Monoclonal Antibodies" http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/psp4.12224/pdf

Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by robbiep on Sunday February 11, 2018 @10:00PM (#16356222)
Even if an antibody was eliminated, and managed to bind to an antigen, what good is it if it doesn’t have a complementary immune system to act on it
Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by IIIIIIIIIIIIIII on Monday February 12, 2018 @03:37AM (#16357346)
Yes, that's actually the main point, thanks!

I missed it when I wrote my reply, concentrating on the immediate question (interesting psychological problem) - and then I could not edit it. It bothered me quite a bit but I did not want to write a third reply. Interesting to see how easy it is to get sidetracked on an irrelevant (albeit interesting) question, and how hard it is to get the discussion back on track.

Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by IIIIIIIIIIIIIII on Sunday February 11, 2018 @02:06PM (#16354171)
Shouldn't I be able to edit this for a little while? Strange, only two minutes later and I can't edit. It had no replies.

I tried adding this quote from the linked paper:

> Thus, IgG elimination occurs mostly through intracellular catabolism by lysosomal degradation to amino acids after uptake by either pinocytosis, an unspecific fluid phase endocytosis, or by a receptor-mediated endocytosis process.

Explanation of two words in there that maybe not everybody knows:

pinocytosis: The ingestion of liquid into a cell by the budding of small vesicles from the cell membrane.

endocytosis: The taking in of matter by a living cell by invagination of its membrane to form a vacuole.

EDIT: I can still edit this comment more than five minutes later, as expected. Hmm... why could I not do that with my first comment...?

Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by vanderZwan on Sunday February 11, 2018 @02:53PM (#16354393)
If this was your literal first comment, it could be some form of SPAM or trolling protection
Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by IIIIIIIIIIIIIII on Sunday February 11, 2018 @03:11PM (#16354502)
It was the 2nd comment, and since it's not been very long since the first one I remember that I edited it quite extensively, many times, for well over five minutes. This time I could start editing but could not (successfully) submit the edited text just two minutes after posting the comment, according to the time printed just above my comment after I submitted the edit (which only showed the text before the edit, and the "Edit" link was now gone).
Re:Why does drug resistance easily evolve but vaccine resist... by vanderZwan on Sunday February 11, 2018 @07:43PM (#16355702)
Then I don't know. You normally have around one hour to edit, IIRC.