News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by user5994461 on Thursday December 21, 2017 @03:46PM (#15982588)
Looks like a case for anti trust, just like microsoft had with IE.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by alwillis on Friday December 22, 2017 @02:56AM (#15985922)
Looks like a case for anti trust, just like microsoft had with IE.

You must be new around here. ;-)

Microsoft used their natural monopoly in operating systems (Windows has 95% marketshare) to force OEMs (HP, Compaq, etc.) to bundle IE with their machines and not Netscape Navigator. Microsoft threaten to cancel their Windows licenses.

And later, it decided, against its decent decree with the US government, to bundle IE with Windows, claiming Windows wouldn't function without IE, which was a lie.

Perhaps you're not aware that natural monopolies are themselves not illegal; it's using that monopoly to force the market to do things it ordinarily wouldn't in some other area.

So… no, there are no antitrust issues regarding web engines on iOS. And of course, Google, Mozilla and others have browsers on the App Store that use WebKit anyway, so it would be hard to make the case they're being harmed…

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by jen20 on Thursday December 21, 2017 @03:51PM (#15982616)
Why? iOS has by most measures less than 50% of the market.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by connorelsea on Thursday December 21, 2017 @04:15PM (#15982832)
Even with a low market share Apple could still theoretically be engaging in practices that are anti-consumer, such as disallowing the use of other browser engines.

Though, afaik, Apple does not stoop to the levels of Amazon, who removed the Twitch app from Roku platform for absolutely no reason other than to line their pockets with more cash.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by Someone on Thursday December 21, 2017 @07:41PM (#15984315)
Anti-trust is there for cases where society thinks

1) the free market doesn’t work because it is too hard for competition to enter an existing market or for existing competition to dethrone a market leader.

_and_

2) the big player(s) take (too much) advantage of their position by engaging in ‘anti-consumer’ practices.

Given the existence of Android, Apple isn’t in position 1. So, do you think (2) alone is sufficient for taking legal action? The common thinking is that the market will take care of it by by bankrupting the company doing it.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by devit on Friday December 22, 2017 @08:20AM (#15987195)
Android doesn't run iOS apps.

Apple has a monopoly on OSes that run iOS apps, OSes that run on iPhones, phones that run iOS and on App Stores that can install iOS apps.

They abuse all of them (e.g. the Webkit-only issue for iOS, monopoly pricing on iPhones, censorship in App Store).

Conversely e.g. Google has none of these monopolies except for the monopoly in running perfectly apps that require Google Play Services.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by jhasse on Friday December 22, 2017 @09:14AM (#15987533)
> Apple has a monopoly on OSes that run iOS apps, OSes that run on iPhones, phones that run iOS and on App Stores that can install iOS apps.

You could also say that Samsung has a monopoly of smartphones with "SAMSUNG" printed on them.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by baddox on Thursday December 21, 2017 @05:38PM (#15983511)
Aren’t anticompetitive and anti-consumer two completely separate things?
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by connorelsea on Thursday December 21, 2017 @05:41PM (#15983538)
Yes, but I would say that anti-competitive behavior is inherently anti-consumer, as the consumer does not benefit from it - and Apple preventing other browser engines is both
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by joshred on Thursday December 21, 2017 @04:50PM (#15983112)
Before they purchased it?
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by connorelsea on Thursday December 21, 2017 @06:24PM (#15983869)
Nah, after - to make it a "Fire TV Exclusive" app

http://www.cordcuttersnews.com/amazon-pulls-twitch-channel-r...

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by threeseed on Thursday December 21, 2017 @03:56PM (#15982663)
1) iOS is not a monopoly.

2) Apple has legitimate technical reasons for not allowing other browser engines (well specifically the JS part). Intent matters.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by Spivak on Thursday December 21, 2017 @05:19PM (#15983379)
I think this thread is full of people who want Apple be considered a monopoly more than care about whether they actually are.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by pjmlp on Friday December 22, 2017 @02:02AM (#15985747)
Thinking what the law should be, doesn't change what it actually is.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by alwillis on Friday December 22, 2017 @02:57AM (#15985926)
Ding ding ding!
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by riquito on Thursday December 21, 2017 @04:12PM (#15982803)
> Apple has legitimate technical reasons for not allowing other browser engines (well specifically the JS part). Intent matters.

Oh please... source?

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by 0x0 on Thursday December 21, 2017 @06:00PM (#15983681)
Efficient javascript needs to be JIT'ed, but that means your app needs to be granted API access to map writeable memory as executable, which is a security risk they are not willing to grant third party developers. So a third party browser/js engine will likely be quite slow. I guess this would give users of a bad impression of iOS perfomance as a whole then, if other browser engines were allowed and became popular?
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by jononor on Thursday December 21, 2017 @07:50PM (#15984367)
If other browser engines became very popular it says something about how bad/limited the default offering is. It usually takes a lot of work before people switch away from defaults. People continued to use IE for years for example
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by millstone on Friday December 22, 2017 @03:24AM (#15986028)
Chrome as the sole advertisement on the most valuable piece of web real estate in the universe might have been a factor too.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by devit on Friday December 22, 2017 @08:22AM (#15987203)
It's not a security risk (assuming a properly engineered OS).
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by 0x0 on Friday December 22, 2017 @08:29AM (#15987243)
All OSes have bugs, and the XNU kernel certainly has had its share, so removing the ability to execute arbitrary code definitively makes exploitation of buffer overflows etc in 3rd party apps much harder.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by kbenson on Thursday December 21, 2017 @08:22PM (#15984542)
Restricting the JS engine but allowing other browser engines to tie into it so you could leverage different browser's rendering and CSS features would be a step up and would sidestep much of the problem.
Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by threeseed on Thursday December 21, 2017 @05:56PM (#15983655)
Remote execution of code is a very popular attack vector.

Apple can negate this almost entirely by controlling JavascriptCore and WebKit and ensuring that their security models e.g. sandbox are tight and well tested. Leaving that up to third parties who may not be so vigilant compromises the security of the entire device.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by pls2halp on Thursday December 21, 2017 @04:43PM (#15983064)
1) JavaScript allows for arbitrary code execution

2) Apple’s App Store policies disallow the user from executing arbitrary code

I think you can figure this out yourself.

Re:Chrome is Not the Standard by toxican on Thursday December 21, 2017 @04:51PM (#15983129)
These are excuses, not valid technical reasons.