I was thinking this myself. For all of Musk's braggadocio about not needing, and even being hurt by, subsidies, Tesla, whose profits only become more negative every quarter, has had its sales decimated in the countries that ended tax breaks for electric vehicles.

With the specter of a major tax overhaul and massive spending cuts, a major recall, and still not enough strength to stand on its own, Musk has to be at least a little worried about Tesla's future and the futures of his other pet projects.

I’m surprised. At the rate PV has been falling these subsidies are probably negligible (federal rebate withstanding).

I purchased PV because the cost with a 20-year loan comes out to be 13c kWh, meanwhile PG&E charges 29c kWh. And the loan interest is tax-deductible.

If you purchase with a loan, you can get a much better deal and it can make sense.

A lot of the solar companies were selling their low interest $0 down lease programs and they themselves were benefiting from the credits/rebates not the homeowner. Homeowners didn't really have to have a great credit score either. Once the credits and rebates went away, the lease programs weren't sustainable for the solar companies.

What company did you use? I have received 3 quotes and none make much sense.

Solarcity. Highly recommended.

Weird. I had them come by for a quote and they were about 25% more than the second closest bid. I never did the full math. This was on a 5kW installation.

My email is in my profile if you want my details. Our system is 6.8kwh. I didn’t go with solarcity because they were the cheapest.

That rate is much higher than I paid in Texas or pay in New Jersey. In fact, I can buy wind power from Green Mountain for less than your solar install cost.

Totally agree, it makes sense in many parts of the country because of a combination of incumbent electricity costs as well as high number of sunny days.

Just a few miles away in Santa Clara it would make no sense at all, since they have their own utility where power costs just 10c kWh.

There is something nice knowing your electricity costs are relatively fixed for 20 years though, since the price tends to follow the rate of inflation and the loan is fixed.

> It is risky basing too much of a business on tax credits and rebates.

This is/was an open secret not only in the solar industry but the entire renewable/clean energy industry ( wind, geo, etc ). These solar companies existed solely because of government support and everyone knew that once the government support was pulled, these companies would immediately be bankrupt.

The first solar companies to fall were those based in germany/uk/spain when european governments pulled the solar subsidies. Followed by the solar companies in the US. Even the chinese solar companies are struggling now.

But the biggest problem going forward for the solar/wind/etc industry is low oil/gas prices. But even with the most optimistic projections, solar would be a relatively small portion of global energy source even by 2050.

Recall that Musk has been begging Congress to end the subsidies (broadly defined), which are distorting the market.

Odd that he didn't have an objection to it when Tesla was benefiting from it.. but once Tesla 3 sales crossed that 200k threshold, and set the end date on the subsidy for Tesla... then Musk comes out and says 'We MUST end this subsidy for everyone immediately'.

Real principled stance there.

Let me just state that Elon musk has , in fact mentioned going zero on subsidies before the 200k , namely, qhen bob lutz was critizizing the subsidies and loans tesla got, he offered a competition where everybod would go to zero subsidies.

You mean the comments Lutz made in Oct 2016?

There were 325k model 3 preorders in April 2016.

Tesla has been in business since 2003. Show me a comment from 10 years ago of musk complaining about subsidies.

You know , you're right! I had my timelines mixed. I do still think that elon musk's companies get singled out quite strongly when they take advantage of the subsidies that a lot of these companies take part in, to much higher degree. I guess his companies bear so much vitriolitic commentary, it's hard to distinguish actual valid criticism from the other things.

I suppose it's a quick way to kill of the competition.

man, I have to respect the guy's PR team.